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Re: Limit Theory @ PAX South 2018 Recap

#62
BFett wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:16 pm
FormalMoss wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:17 pm
Talvieno wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:12 pm
Personally I hope he includes a sandbox mode. I'd greatly enjoy that - and I know you (and a lot of other people) would too. It's just a matter of convincing Josh that it would be worth the time spent. :D
What's a sandbox mode vs what LT is going to be?
I thought it was a sandbox single person game to begin with.. :eh:
I think Tal means a sandbox in terms of a very malleable universe, not in the sense that you won't be able to do anything you like within the game world.
Yet Josh has just said that Vanilla LT will be a mod, so changing anything will just involve a text editor.
In light of the above, does that make LT 1.0 a sandbox game.. out of the box! :D
YAY PYTHON \o/

In Josh We Trust
-=326.3827=-
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Re: Limit Theory @ PAX South 2018 Recap

#65
Victor Tombs wrote:
Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:31 am
Talvieno wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:53 pm
Yes, I mean an open sandbox/cheat mode where you can spawn ships at will, delete ships at will, buy anything you want with infinite money, edit factions, etc. Essentially still Limit Theory, but everything is directly editable and you're basically a god.
I'm surprised anyone gets any satisfaction from that sort of gameplay, Nathan. :?
Victor, let me try to elaborate:
For achievers, obviously this kind of gameplay is absolutely uninteresting. What is the point of reward without the difficulty to get it?

Also for the people interested in the smooth graphic and the in-game exploration, a full God mode is not what they need, as they don’t want to control the result, but want to discover within the procedural universe.
But already there, they may not want to have to play hours to mine and make trades to finally upgrade from a small defenseless shuttle ship to an explorer, long range, heavily shielded and fast ship that really allow worry-free sightseeing. Why force him to play what he don’t like before taking off to the stars?

But more extreme are the people interested in exploring mechanics of the game. For instance fleet and empire management. They want to generate a situation and see how it evolves, how it feels. I want to control a multi-system empire, but I don’t want to be forced to build it during hours that I simply do not have (job, family, ...).
For this, a god mode allow me to spend my precious time playing exactly the game i want, and not trying to work through the long step to enable it.

Hope this helps clarify?
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Re: Limit Theory @ PAX South 2018 Recap

#72
I think I'll play like Victor, the traditional way. Though I do get the appeal of poking the simulation and watching it react.

On the topic of simulation, you know, I've been thinking that there's this key thing I believe will make LT a better game than NMS.

Open world games are dependent on two pillars- systems and mechanics. Both need to be good for a game to work. For example, in Far Cry 3, the shooting, stealth, swimming, gliding, traversal etc are mechanics, while the AI of the guards and the animals, the whole setup of the outposts etc. are systems that the player can interact with, and which change and react to the player's actions. Far Cry 3 is a great game because it has fun mechanics and robust systems.

Look at NMS on the other hand (on release). All its mechanics, ranging from space combat to ground combat to mining to traversal were simplistic, dull and unfun. As for systems, NMS had none. Nothing reacts to you in game. There's no simulation (which is funny because that's the entire storyline) to play with. I do still love NMS for its atmosphere and ambition though. Interestingly enough, the one mechanic they nailed was the driving of the exocraft, which makes sense considering Sean's Burnout background at Criterion.

Limit Theory looks like it will have great mechanics, and there's no doubt that it's a deep simulation game. I cant wait for it.
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Re: Limit Theory @ PAX South 2018 Recap

#74
Victor Tombs wrote:
Mon Jan 22, 2018 9:13 pm
Vartul wrote:
Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:16 pm
I think I'll play like Victor, the traditional way.
I can't tell you how happy it makes me feel when members say they intend playing the game in the traditional way, Vartul. :thumbup: :angel:

:shifty: I sometimes get the feeling that I'm a bit of a relic here.
Not one bit!

You'll never hear me say there's anything wrong with wanting to win through playing by the rules. (And you're welcome to read that statement in more than one way. ;) )

In fact, I'm very much looking forward to hearing your impressions of LT once you're finally able to play it, Victor, precisely because I'm wondering how much of the "game" flavor of Freelancer that Josh will be able to (or want to) embed in Limit Theory.

Freelancer was basically an open-world game; there was a main story with missions and side quests, but subject to some mission-based gates, you could eventually fly wherever you wanted and just trade things or shoot ships. If you wanted to stick with the main story until you beat the game, you certainly could do that... but how much of a "main story" will LT have? From what I recall Josh saying previously, it sounds like he's not intending to write a fixed story for LT players to experience.

Instead, LT sounds more like -- Theory Time! -- it will be something near to "Freelancer without stories." It will offer all of Freelancer's freedom to explore and trade and fight and do basic missions, but Freelancer's story content is replaced in LT by a blend of RTS/4X goals that are achieved by engaging with LT's simulation/procgen features.

1. Does any Official Person want to correct that theory?

2. Does it sound like it'll be good fun for the fans of Freelancer who like a relatively more structured game?

(Note: As usual, none of the above is intended as criticism that requires any kind of defense -- I'm just thinking out loud.)
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Re: Limit Theory @ PAX South 2018 Recap

#75
Flatfingers wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:51 am
You'll never hear me say there's anything wrong with wanting to win through playing by the rules. (And you're welcome to read that statement in more than one way. )
I certainly can't recall you ever saying there was anything wrong with playing by the rules, Flat. :)
Flatfingers wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:51 am
In fact, I'm very much looking forward to hearing your impressions of LT once you're finally able to play it, Victor, precisely because I'm wondering how much of the "game" flavor of Freelancer that Josh will be able to (or want to) embed in Limit Theory.
I continue to keep in mind that Josh promised me a satisfying Freelancer experience so I'm hoping that will be the case, Flat. Only time will tell. :)
Flatfingers wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:51 am
Freelancer was basically an open-world game; there was a main story with missions and side quests, but subject to some mission-based gates, you could eventually fly wherever you wanted and just trade things or shoot ships. If you wanted to stick with the main story until you beat the game, you certainly could do that... but how much of a "main story" will LT have? From what I recall Josh saying previously, it sounds like he's not intending to write a fixed story for LT players to experience.
I've already written in these forums that I mourn the loss of some of the parts of Freelancer that I thoroughly enjoyed. I have the same understanding as you concerning the lack of any "main story" in Limit Theory. Although I would have enjoyed teaming up with some of the characters in the original I'm not expecting that to be the case, Flat. It's true to say that the original Freelancer needed additional DLC to continue the storyline as it took a little time to adjust to the game after all the main characters took the one-way trip to somewhere inaccessible to Edison. I really would have enjoyed more adventures with Juni.
Flatfingers wrote:
Tue Jan 23, 2018 12:51 am
Instead, LT sounds more like -- Theory Time! -- it will be something near to "Freelancer without stories." It will offer all of Freelancer's freedom to explore and trade and fight and do basic missions, but Freelancer's story content is replaced in LT by a blend of RTS/4X goals that are achieved by engaging with LT's simulation/procgen features.
Yes, that's how it sounds to me, Flat. And as I'm not really a fan of RTS/4X I'm probably going to need some good mods to help ease my pain. :angel:

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