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More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub systems.

#1
Instead of a destroyed sub system only making it less functional or non-functional if could have more interesting effects happen at random (with the probability being effected by the weapon used on it like missiles causing more of them than lasers on a sub system). Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust. Really I don't have an amazing way to explain it so if it is impossible to understand then my apologies to you.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#2
Ravi wrote:Instead of a destroyed sub system only making it less functional or non-functional if could have more interesting effects happen at random (with the probability being effected by the weapon used on it like missiles causing more of them than lasers on a sub system). Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust. Really I don't have an amazing way to explain it so if it is impossible to understand then my apologies to you.
Like a flat tyre screws with the steering of your car?
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#4
jawdan wrote:
Ravi wrote:Instead of a destroyed sub system only making it less functional or non-functional if could have more interesting effects happen at random (with the probability being effected by the weapon used on it like missiles causing more of them than lasers on a sub system). Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust. Really I don't have an amazing way to explain it so if it is impossible to understand then my apologies to you.
Like a flat tyre screws with the steering of your car?
Sort of, however having a flat tire would do that almost all of the time, these effects will only be occasional to mix up combat a little bit.
Dadalos wrote:this describes more the flight mech used in star citizen. in LT i think were going for more expected all or nothing system.
IE ether your engines are working or they are offline. your shields are fine or they are gone. ect.
Can't exactly say much there unless Josh posts saying otherwise.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#5
Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust.
Geez, I dunno. Bascially, you're screwing with the controls in an environment (3-dimensional space with pseudo-newtonian physics) where screwed up controls are seven flavours of unfun already. Same for Josh's idea of having engine damage leave you adrift in a worst-case scenario.

Seriously, players fricking *hate* it when they lose control over their avatar. Doesn't matter whether you're dying in a stunlock or your plane goes into a death spiral, you're basically screwed and the game gives you the finger by unnecessarily dragging out the unavoidable.
Seriously, if my options are to wait 20 minutes real-time for a passing ship to tow me to a station (or a bunch of passing enemies to grant me the coup de grâce ) or trying to navigate to a station when my thrusters are actively working against that idea, then I'll hit reload. Every. Single. Time. That. Happens.

I *seriously* suggest to implement an auto-repair for damaged subsystems, with an actual auto-repair system speeding the process up and providing hull repair as well. Why? Because thrusters, shields and weapons conking out can be somewhat fun if it's temporary. If you're in deep space without any friendly stations around, it's a death sentence without at least the critical subsystems coming back.
I could probably also live with a "critical existence failure" damage model where everything is fine and dandy until the hull points are depleted (after which things explode). It's unrealistic, but it beats getting "lost in space" every time some AI scores a lucky hit.
Hardenberg was my name
And Terra was my nation
Deep space is my dwelling place
The stars my destination
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#6
i can see where Hardenberg is coming from in that some people would find it irritating as hell to drag out things like losing thrusters and ether waiting on the inevitable or reloading a prefious save.

personally i like the idea of thrusters or other ship components going out and dealing with the consequences. it rewards the prepared player for having the ability to adapt and plan ahead and give some in game consequence to your actions. In most online games noone give 1 damn about weather they actually die or not if you do ya it sucks but its nothing more than a spedd bump because you immediately respawn with out any serious harm. it teaches players that death is more annoying than an actual threatening event. having the responsibility to live with your actions appeals to me in a game thats this well planned and developed.
If I've rambled and gone off topic im sorry but i tend to be long winded as you might notice if you stumble across my other post XD. thanks for reading.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#7
Hardenberg wrote:
Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust.
Geez, I dunno. Bascially, you're screwing with the controls in an environment (3-dimensional space with pseudo-newtonian physics) where screwed up controls are seven flavours of unfun already. Same for Josh's idea of having engine damage leave you adrift in a worst-case scenario.

Seriously, players fricking *hate* it when they lose control over their avatar. Doesn't matter whether you're dying in a stunlock or your plane goes into a death spiral, you're basically screwed and the game gives you the finger by unnecessarily dragging out the unavoidable.
Seriously, if my options are to wait 20 minutes real-time for a passing ship to tow me to a station (or a bunch of passing enemies to grant me the coup de grâce ) or trying to navigate to a station when my thrusters are actively working against that idea, then I'll hit reload. Every. Single. Time. That. Happens.

I *seriously* suggest to implement an auto-repair for damaged subsystems, with an actual auto-repair system speeding the process up and providing hull repair as well. Why? Because thrusters, shields and weapons conking out can be somewhat fun if it's temporary. If you're in deep space without any friendly stations around, it's a death sentence without at least the critical subsystems coming back.
I could probably also live with a "critical existence failure" damage model where everything is fine and dandy until the hull points are depleted (after which things explode). It's unrealistic, but it beats getting "lost in space" every time some AI scores a lucky hit.
I say that engines can not be completely destroyed and will only operate at 25% of max power when "destroyed" to prevent being stranded. I can understand the annoyance with the controls, however that would/should only apply to the engine at max or near max throttles. This idea was more or less to give an alternative to complete loss of effectiveness.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#10
I'm not really happy with this "speeding up time" business.
Basically, this will require all of the universe around you to move at increased speed as well, and will usually increase processor load a lot while doing so due to the amount of calculations required.
The X series in infamous for using this feature, and it worsened the game considerably: The accuracy of the AI and the physics was decreased to remove processor load, leading to such wonderful things as the legendary "autopillock" (the pilot AI in particular couldn't handle being sped up on slower CPU systems, resulting in ship collisions all over the place).

I'd rather prefer some type of "cruise mode" with all power routed to the engines to facilitate faster in-system travel (basically, the way Freelancer handled in-system travel).
Hardenberg was my name
And Terra was my nation
Deep space is my dwelling place
The stars my destination
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#11
Hardenberg wrote:I'm not really happy with this "speeding up time" business.
Basically, this will require all of the universe around you to move at increased speed as well, and will usually increase processor load a lot while doing so due to the amount of calculations required.
The X series in infamous for using this feature, and it worsened the game considerably: The accuracy of the AI and the physics was decreased to remove processor load, leading to such wonderful things as the legendary "autopillock" (the pilot AI in particular couldn't handle being sped up on slower CPU systems, resulting in ship collisions all over the place).

I'd rather prefer some type of "cruise mode" with all power routed to the engines to facilitate faster in-system travel (basically, the way Freelancer handled in-system travel).
I say that it can be handled like in Elite where in combat or other similar things you have time stuck at 1x and when travelling with little to nothing happening you can multiply it where the game will then use estimates (like kerbal space program) to determine events.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#12
It seems to me that every time he's used time speed-up it's been a turn on/off by checkbox/hotkey feature, so it seems up to us wheter or not to use it.

As for damage causing random effects, i like the idea, but both deciding what should go wrong and rendering the effect would add code and as Hardenberg said "players fricking *hate* it when they lose control over their avatar."

I so agree with the idea that a system is never completely destroyed, and simply needs to be repaired. Not realistic, but why stick to reality when it's just gonna piss us off to be stranded in a backwater system that cant repair our brand new top of the line gear. Also, "autorepair" does make sense. There's technically at least one person on each ship, and they would be capable of repairing it. We could trough in the concept of spare parts (or not) to make things more interesting ("I was dumb and didnt make sure I had this part, well now I know it actually IS important and I SHOULD buy it"). In that case however, a spare part should never strand you, just inconvenience you.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#14
Hardenberg wrote:
Lets say an engine was hit by a medium power missile, instead of just giving slightly less thrust it could give thrust in a slightly different direction or if it has hit by a fairly good laser it could have a hole (a decal applied to it with thrust and fire particles flying out) that could cause your ship to begin spinning when there is too much thrust.


It comes down to realism vs fun, and how it's balanced. what was suggested is a good idea from a realism perspective, but I know that I would dislike this. One of my pet peevs of any game is having control taken from the player.
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Re: More "unique" effects to damaged or destoryed sub system

#15
I really would actually enjoy to have a rahter big list of circumstances that could happen, while in combat, to inconvenience the situation. I am saying it could be that weapons are jamming if, ie that your aluminium cases for the railgun got stuck in the reloading tube, or a safety got burned through in your "pew pew laser".



But regarding the damage, I think only engines shouldn't be able to be completely destryoed, so you can always "limp" away.

Repairing this damage:

Well I liked the whole gameplay in FTL to have your crew assigned and I know mid dogfight, well...
you can't really manage your crew^^, but imagine having a similar interface, where your subsystems are portrayed, the grade of damage colourcoded visualised and your crew/ robots/ nanobots whatever we can use to repair, to then assign your capacities to the system which should have the highest priority to be repaired.

Either this could be done after for better efficiency or usually there is this form of autorepair that is always working and has the form of "percentage of damage repaired/ second" while taking up energy maybe?

Not too sure, just wanted to bring in the intersting repair mechanic and management from FTL :)
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