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Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#1
I'd like to suggest a new set set/category of 'traits' or personality definers based around the long term goals of NPCs. We have things which seem suitable for mid-short term goals such as 'make money' or 'grow more powerful', but I'd like to see more interesting 'Dreams' of these NPCs. Aspirations would be randomly assigned goals, based around/ influenced by the 'starting environment' of the NPC, and not necessarily their personal characteristics. For example, one NPC might want to become an entrepreneurial businessman who can change the world through his business, but have personality traits suited towards an industrious miner instead. Of course, not all NPCs or people in real life end up following their dreams; for this I recommend a scale between Sensibility and Idealism, which affects exactly how much the NPC's Aspiration affects their behaviour. Our aforementioned NPC with a moderate Sensibility quotient might be sensible enough to be a miner, knowing that its a secure life choice, whilse maintaining a small business on the side as a 'hobby'. An NPC with a high Idealism might chase his dreams and end up destitute, or perhaps luckily find success. At the same time, being far removed from your Aspiration might act to increase negative emotions in an NPC, or to decrease attributes like Sociable.

Sensibility should, as a general rule, increase with continued failures, and Idealism should increase with continued successes. This could simulate the overconfidence of people who 'have it easy' for most of their life and also the wisdom of age. Sensibility and Idealism might also affect the risk-averse or risk-taking nature of NPCs in regular gameplay too.
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#3
Mori24 wrote:It's a cool idea and obviously it would make the game more real, but is it actually possible? I know Josh mentioned high-level thinking for NPCs but emotions and all those sophisticated relations and links isn't a little TOO high-level?
Nope.
Definitely possible.
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The most intriguing fact about imagination is that its all in your head.
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#5
Josh's last reveal of NPC personality traits showed these:
  • Aggressive
  • Creative
  • Explorative
  • Greedy
  • Intellectual
  • Lawless
  • Sociable
There are a number of ways that aspirations might flow from and enhance these traits.

One, as suggested, could be to key Sensible and Idealistic aspirations to each trait. A Sensible aspiration for the Explorative trait might be "sell 5 maps of new places," while an Idealistic aspiration for that trait could be "establish relations with 5 new civilizations."

If 14 types of aspirations aren't enough (with multiple specific aspirations for each type), this could be greatly extended by having both Sensible and Idealistic aspirations for each of the endpoints of a trait, as well as for the "moderate" segment. A character who is high in Lawless could have Sensible and Idealistic aspirations; ditto for an NPC with a high Lawful trait; and likewise for the NPC who is moderately opportunistic -- and so on for the six other traits.

I'd be interested in seeing some other specific suggestions for aspirations that characters in LT might have.

Other Thought 1: Can achieving an aspiration grant some kind of benefit? For example, if I satisfy an aspiration of "discover a major new technology," should I get a nice bonus of some sort in addition to the direct reward of whatever I just accomplished? If not (and I could be OK with "not"), how should the game document for the character that they attained an aspiration?

Other Thought 2: Particularly if aspirations can grant in-game benefits, should the player's character be able to have aspirations?

Other Thought 3: Josh's devlog on "Colonies, Culture, and Local Item Generation" suggests that colonies will have "personalities" similar to those of characters. Should colonies also have aspirations? Should they also resemble the aspirations of individual NPCs, or should colonies have their own more applicable kinds of aspirations?
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#7
Victor Tombs wrote:It all sounds good to me, Flat. :thumbup:

I'm hoping that the NPC's are so lifelike that I wouldn't be surprised if one of them made me my Marmite on toast for breakfast. :D :D

Yes, I know it's a pipedream but I do wonder what some of Josh's games will be like when I'm too old to appreciate them. I'm sure these youngsters have a real treat in store for them . :angel:
I really don't want some Npc nagging me to go to the gym more or calling me fat or mocking my mortality, depending on their personalities, because it is utilizing my camera and knows I just had a slice of Pie... So hopefully they aren't too smart.

also good idea op, it seems easily possible to make something like that work, if maybe a little limited.
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#8
Hyperion wrote:
Victor Tombs wrote:I really don't want some Npc nagging me to go to the gym more or calling me fat or mocking my mortality, depending on their personalities, because it is utilizing my camera and knows I just had a slice of Pie... So hopefully they aren't too smart.
:lol: When you do all the mundane jobs yourself, Hyperion, it would be a pleasant change to have "something" doing that stuff for you. ;) :angel:
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#11
Kambalo wrote:I would like to see also the possibility of religion or spirituality traits created as well. Since the dawn of time faith and spirituality have been 2 elements always present in the development of civilization.
I think religion fits nicely under creativity. You have to have a sense of imagination to be spiritual in the first place.
That, and religion is a proto-science in reality, it was used as a way to describe phenomena we had no way of understanding (like lightening) that developed into a complex social network of moral ethics, laws and guidelines. Religion, while it may exist, just doesn't fit into the cold, scientific world of limit theory, although religion would play an interesting role...
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The most intriguing fact about imagination is that its all in your head.
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#13
Scytale wrote:As a religious person who works to expand the knowledgebase of the physical sciences every day, I can say with some authority that that is an entirely inadequate description of what religion is.
I should clarify that, in the first half of that sentence, I was referring to paganism; while in the later half, I was referring to modern religion as having evolved from its proto-scientific roots to be more encompassing and far-reaching.
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The most intriguing fact about imagination is that its all in your head.
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#14
HKY09 wrote:
Scytale wrote:As a religious person who works to expand the knowledgebase of the physical sciences every day, I can say with some authority that that is an entirely inadequate description of what religion is.
I should clarify that, in the first half of that sentence, I was referring to paganism; while in the later half, I was referring to modern religion as having evolved from its proto-scientific roots to be more encompassing and far-reaching.
Ah I see, I'll back down then~ cheers for the clarification
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Re: Aspiration, Sensibility and Idealism.

#15
Flat, all those ideas were really cool. I hadn't thought about entities like factions having their own Aspirations but that seems like it could be intrinsically tied to the way the nation's 'personality' type which Josh has talked about forms. However, I'm not sure how we could effectively integrate that with the NPCs and the player, since nations wouldn't really follow the Sensibility vs Idealism scale. The first thought I had was propaganda based around national ideals and factions which could end up like America and Russia in the Cold War, but that seems like it would be really hard to implement.

Another thought I had was about a third, independant factor in the way NPCs act on the Sensibility-Idealism scale. The one I detailed in the original post assumes all NPCs will learn from their actions, and that those who get bitten will become more cynical... but what if we implemented a 'Stubbornness' scale as well? This would be randomly distributed in a bell curve, such that there are mostly moderately stubborn NPCs, very few pushovers and very few reckless idiots. It would be one of the only factors that couldn't be changed, simply so that you'd always have a couple of outliers who act completely unpredictably.


EDIT: Reading your post again, my opinion is that fulfilling aspirations is beneficial in that it would give a morale boost and also increase 'happiness' in the NPC, and mostly act by modifying their personality traits-increasing sociable, or increasing creativity. Maybe if they feel like they've achieved everything they ever wanted in life they might become extremely Lawless, etc. There are a lot of ways you could take it. I don't think it should give a material benefit though, since the usefulness/moneymaking potential inherit in the goals themselves need to be weighed up against each other to properly simulate idealism vs sensibility.

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