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Re: Missiles in the games

#31
The only problem I see with missiles is they can get really OP REALLY fast if they are not balanced right. If simply parking a missile boat and launching enough to overwhelm anything works it will be game breaking in my opinion. Therefore anti-missile defense should be REALLY good in my opinion.

Yet not as good as the basically perfect mosquito missile defense script from the X games. In particular it should be a very viable tactic to use bomber craft to launch torpedoes that can evade/tank the screen (The tradeoff is they are slower so can be cut to pieces by interceptors)
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Re: Missiles in the games

#32
Laser shields, can take out X missiles per minute, or can confuse and deflect N(X) missiles per minute. maybe an advanced enough, efficient, powerful enough laser shield could be the perfect foil to a rain of missiles, perhaps even have dedicated laser shield ships in a fleet, perhaps creating the 3D version of the tortuga formation... All just cat and mouse
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Re: Missiles in the games

#33
That also depends on how detailed the sensor mechanics get and how much of this mechanics missles use.

If its like i suggested here and missles home in using their own sensors (which should be pretty narrow-band for common missles) we can create devices which disrupt missle sensors or chaffs which confuse them without creating many additional systems.

So we could add ECM, chaff and similar stuff in addition to shooting it down, running away or taking the hit
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Re: Missiles in the games

#34
Cornflakes_91 wrote:So we could add ECM, chaff and similar stuff in addition to shooting it down, running away or taking the hit
Oh yes, countermeasures are a must. Freelancer and Elite style versions are superb ideas for dealing with such threats. Not always fully effective which sometimes resulted in edge of the seat experiences. :D
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Re: Missiles in the games

#35
Sasha wrote:Best missile defence I've seen in a game is the design of Minmatar ships in EVE online. those giant, seemingly superflous fins their ships have would act as a very visible and easily targetable feature for RADAR. If a missile hits one, it does next to no real damage because they're just fins.
Heh heh, I made a game with this... :D It didn't work quite the same way - weapons had blast radii, and if a gun hardpoint was within range of the blast, it got taken out if the shields were down. Some of the ships I designed had fins or "cages" for missiles to blow up on.

Most of the feedback I got on it was negative, though.
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Re: Missiles in the games

#36
Talvieno wrote:
Sasha wrote:Best missile defence I've seen in a game is the design of Minmatar ships in EVE online. those giant, seemingly superflous fins their ships have would act as a very visible and easily targetable feature for RADAR. If a missile hits one, it does next to no real damage because they're just fins.
Heh heh, I made a game with this... :D It didn't work quite the same way - weapons had blast radii, and if a gun hardpoint was within range of the blast, it got taken out if the shields were down. Some of the ships I designed had fins or "cages" for missiles to blow up on.

Most of the feedback I got on it was negative, though.
That cages idea. Good start!
I wonder how well a kevlar (or other impact resistant future meta-material) would fare as missile protection if it was held off the hull as a kind of canopy.
sensors and weapons would still have to be exposed to be effective, but the crew may be safer and with a relatively cheap form of defence.
Kevlar would not hold up well to armor-piercing warheads. but by the laws of physics, armor piercing warheads have to detonate before penetrating. Detonating in space instead of on the hull would drastically reduce the effectiveness of a missile. Plus an explosion wouldn't fragment kevlar, it would tear it.

So instead of a missile blowing the entire side of a ship open, it might only punch a hole (where the armor piercing metal penetrates).

If I had access to the equipment, I would be testing this in real life o.o

hmmm. might not even need kevlar. simple cargo netting might suffice. really cheap potentially effective missile armor! (I'm probably wrong) :p
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Re: Missiles in the games

#38
Hyperion wrote:Laser shields, can take out X missiles per minute, or can confuse and deflect N(X) missiles per minute. maybe an advanced enough, efficient, powerful enough laser shield could be the perfect foil to a rain of missiles, perhaps even have dedicated laser shield ships in a fleet, perhaps creating the 3D version of the tortuga formation... All just cat and mouse
That still leaves "moar missiles NAO!" as a solution to that. Why risk expensive bomber craft when I can build uber missile spewing capital ships and go BSG Basestar on my foes? Eventually the missiles will overwhelm and hit. Good for a game on modern naval combat. BADLY OP for LT in my opinion.

And that same system would also easily defeat bomber launched torpedoes. Meaning their limited numbers would make them useless.
Cornflakes_91 wrote:That also depends on how detailed the sensor mechanics get and how much of this mechanics missles use.

If its like i suggested here and missles home in using their own sensors (which should be pretty narrow-band for common missles) we can create devices which disrupt missle sensors or chaffs which confuse them without creating many additional systems.

So we could add ECM, chaff and similar stuff in addition to shooting it down, running away or taking the hit
I do like the idea of ECM being a counter to long range torpedoes while being far less effective for close launched torpedoes of bomber craft.
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Re: Missiles in the games

#39
AbhChallenger wrote:
I do like the idea of ECM being a counter to long range torpedoes while being far less effective for close launched torpedoes of bomber craft.
Well, if my suggestion gets implemented fully you get that automatically, as the torpedos sensors wont be able to differentiate between fake and real targets on long range while successfully differentiating them on short range
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Re: Missiles in the games

#40
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
AbhChallenger wrote:
I do like the idea of ECM being a counter to long range torpedoes while being far less effective for close launched torpedoes of bomber craft.
Well, if my suggestion gets implemented fully you get that automatically, as the torpedos sensors wont be able to differentiate between fake and real targets on long range while successfully differentiating them on short range
The problem is. If the target is slow moving (or a station) Will the torpedo then be able to discern the "real" one once it closes range? That would again just lead back to missile spam tactics for the winz". Wut about if the player uses scout craft to "guide" the torpedoes in with very little risk to the craft or costs to do that?

This may be something that in my opinion may force a gamey solution. That being the torpedo only can long onto one "thing" (And by itself no aid from any friendly sensors) once it is launched. If it locks onto a decoy then the launching ship is SOL.

Edit: I have realized a major flaw in this idea. And thus to make short range decoys such as chaff viable. I will amend it to "If a missile ever locks onto a phantom or decoy. It will never change targets back"
Last edited by AbhChallenger on Sat Sep 20, 2014 6:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Missiles in the games

#42
Cornflakes_91 wrote:Or we could invest a few more seconds of brainpower instead of making it gamey :P

Give missles a field of view for their sensors.

So when you steer the missle and yourself out of the missles sensor cone you are safe.

This also makes maneuvering useful for fighters after firing their chaffs, to get out of sight
How is a capital ship or a station going to steer themselves out of a cone of a torpedo?

Now I admit my idea has a major flaw in it because a short range missile would lock onto the enemy and stay there despite decoys. Until a better idea is had I will simply amend it to say the once a missile/torpedo locks onto a decoy or a phantom. It stays there.

So lets watch the comments about "brainpower'
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Re: Missiles in the games

#44
Cornflakes_91 wrote:A station or capital doesnt maneuver, it produces fake images with its active ECM to steer missles away from itself.

A fighter doesnt have room or energy for ECM so it uses short lived chaffs to buy time for steering away
Unless you get gamey and give torpedoes stupidly low FoV. The missiles would be able to "burn through" the ECM and lock on once they have closed range.

I would MUCH rather have gamey "lock onto a phantom or decoy and it's teh game over missile" than gamey low FOV for large torpedoes that have plenty of room to mount a large FOV sensor.
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Re: Missiles in the games

#45
A fighter doesnt have room or energy for ECM so it uses short lived chaffs to buy time for steering away
Says who? These are magical spaceships, who's to say they can't create a dozen or a hundred short lived holograms of themselves and take wildly looping maneuvers to ensure you can never be sure which one is which... They could probably even project pseudo projectiles that are exactly like real projectiles but cause no damage...

Also laser painting sounds like just another good use for lasers... +1 to content
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The conquest of Nature is to be achieved through Number and Measure.
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