Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Field

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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby DWMagus » Thu Jan 30, 2014 3:46 pm

CutterJohn wrote:I'm fine with that, so long as it actually takes effort to stay in that blind spot, and the ship you are hiding from tries to get you out of it(or tries to ram you).

If I can simply hover there with literally zero control inputs, then no, that is awful gameplay.


I think one of the earlier dev videos actually addressed this quite well. I believe Josh mentioned X as well. The idea is to make it tactical/strategic to do something like this, but not make it easy to pull off.

I think trying to treat the player and AI as equal in all cases is the problematic ideology, for the very simple fact that they aren't equal. The simple fact is I will be a much, much better pilot than any AI. And the AI will be a better aim than I could ever dream of. If you don't acknowledge these truths, the game will be flawed.


Going to address the second part first. We know that the AI has the POTENTIAL to be a 'perfect' shot. However, I believe this was also addressed much earlier on (and I'm pretty sure I brought this same issue up) so the AI will need a bit of flaws to make them more practical.

Now the big one, and the crux of everything -- treating the player and AI equal. I agree exactly with you in regards to them not being equal, but as I mentioned in the shield harmonics thread, the AI has ACCESS to the same FUNCTIONALITY as the player. Yeah, they may not be as 'smart' as a person nor as 'capable', but they have access to research better things than the player if they play their cards right. This is what I'm saying. Whether or not the AI can execute what they've done effectively after achieving these advantages is another story.

But what it comes down to, is if we give the player to perfom some function that the AI can not, that is where the problem lies (example only; if the player can strafe but the AI can't).
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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby CutterJohn » Thu Jan 30, 2014 7:27 pm

DWMagus wrote:
I think one of the earlier dev videos actually addressed this quite well. I believe Josh mentioned X as well. The idea is to make it tactical/strategic to do something like this, but not make it easy to pull off.


Well, if he can make it happen without being a player super power, and more importantly, without feeling cheap, I will not complain. But it should be a high risk/low probability gambit, that may work occasionally as a fluke.

I can handle one death star being blown up by fighters targeting a weak spot. Two just stretches credibility.

Now the big one, and the crux of everything -- treating the player and AI equal. I agree exactly with you in regards to them not being equal, but as I mentioned in the shield harmonics thread, the AI has ACCESS to the same FUNCTIONALITY as the player. Yeah, they may not be as 'smart' as a person nor as 'capable', but they have access to research better things than the player if they play their cards right. This is what I'm saying. Whether or not the AI can execute what they've done effectively after achieving these advantages is another story.

But what it comes down to, is if we give the player to perfom some function that the AI can not, that is where the problem lies (example only; if the player can strafe but the AI can't).


My point is that having access to something doesn't mean the AI is smart enough to actually use it properly, and then it could end up as the cheap gimmick, a super power the player is capable of exploiting to win, but not the AI.

Considering how bad AI pathfinding tends to be, I feel that snugging up to a ship and hiding in a crevice is quite likely to become this sort of tactic.
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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby Behemoth » Sat Feb 01, 2014 2:53 am

When I think if it, the wake field resolves few more things than I thought:
  • Making big ships feel bigger
  • Drafting
  • H-drive sensing (+ hiding small ships in the signature of a bigger one)
  • Cruise distruptors
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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby Cornflakes_91 » Thu Jul 07, 2016 1:01 pm

i necro this thread with a link to another forum thread necro \o/

https://forums.inovaestudios.com/t/vide ... totype/709

it extends to more than just docking, but its a nicely unified system
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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby Silverware » Tue Jul 19, 2016 4:39 pm

Cornflakes_91 wrote:i necro this thread with a link to another forum thread necro \o/

https://forums.inovaestudios.com/t/vide ... totype/709

it extends to more than just docking, but its a nicely unified system


Cornflakes_91 wrote:posting this here because its relevant to the whole "wake field" thing.

interesting videos, maybe something thats usable for LT can be extracted from them.

https://forums.inovaestudios.com/t/vide ... totype/709
(basically the videos in the first post)


... did you just twice, seperatly necro this post with the same content each time?
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Re: Fighters and how to make capital ships feel big, Wake Fi

Postby Cornflakes_91 » Tue Jul 19, 2016 5:11 pm

im sleepy, lemme be. :ghost:
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