i think planets should offer training missions as a way to level up npc, and act as a tutorial for beginner players. the missions would only be viewable to players with low levels, and would be completely optional.
i was kinda thinking of a basic set of tasks like mining, combat, trading, etc... after the quests are completed your skills would reflect a greater understanding and the missions would no longer be visible. as for the purpose of the planet offering the mission, perhaps it would be in their best interest to train their pilots a little before they send them off on important tasks, aka establish "trust" or Piloting level or something similar.

Planets already demand "stuff" by default. It' s just up to the player to find said stuff and bring it back to the planet.

I could see the game coming with a pre-made training system with easy to navigate trade lanes to get players used to the game if Josh wanted to...

Elite 1 (I believe?) had tips on how to start out. Printed on paper. Like from a tree.
The fine details you had to work out on your own. =P

An ingame tutorial... I dunno.
Follow the golden arrow? Click the flashing button? Congratulations! You have managed to click on the flashing button. Achievement!

There is one little problem that I have with this . It requires a leveling system . Having a leveling system for an open world, single player game is not my idea of fun .

You do realise that this forum has a leveling system and that you are at "Lieutenant Commander" level?

Are you not having fun?
The moderators want you to have fun. If you are not having fun you can still be used as reactor shielding.

Gazz wrote:You do realise that this forum has a leveling system and that you are at "Lieutenant Commander" level?

Are you not having fun?
The moderators want you to have fun. If you are not having fun you can still be used as reactor shielding.

This is not a single player world .

Zanteogo wrote:Planets already demand "stuff" by default. It' s just up to the player to find said stuff and bring it back to the planet.

I could see the game coming with a pre-made training system with easy to navigate trade lanes to get players used to the game if Josh wanted to...

I have no doubt most people will have no trouble figuring out how to play the game, but a more accessable start to the game will make it easier for a broader range of players, aka kids, children, youth etc...
wouldnt we all like to see this game become a major success?
I personally think a short tutorial makes a game feel like a more professional product. some games can get by without it some cant. one example that i can think of is Minecraft. when i first started playing the game i had no clue how to create anything, no idea what i was supposed to do. lucky for me i researched it on youtube, and used the wiki. but needless to say when my kids started to play the game they were constantly asking how to make things. if it had a tutorial my kids would have been able to figure it out quite easily.
i hope my example makes my thoughts clear, i know minecraft and LT are completely different. its only an example for the lack of a tutorial, and the feel of a less than professional game.

I'm for in-game tutorial as long as you aren't forced into it.

I realize that back in the days of the original Elite or Mario Bros there really was no manual. But nowadays, you kind of need it.

Pfft! Elite had BOTH a manual as well as a booklet with a short story. =P

Idunno wrote:There is one little problem that I have with this . It requires a leveling system . Having a leveling system for an open world, single player game is not my idea of fun .

why is it that you think it "needs" a leveling system?
I will leave the implementation of this kinda thing to the experts, but i do have alternatives to leveling.
Maybe its a simple trigger, the tutorial only appears for the first hour of gameplay.
Maybe its a trigger, you get asked "want to take the tutorial?" yes, no...
Maybe you gain proficiency with the things you do as a pilot, mine a lot? gain proficiency in mining. the tutorial quests go away after you gain some experience in a few different areas.
Maybe instead of a tutorial its more like the beginning steps to gain trust/reputation/faith whatever. the "tutorial" only appears when you have no reputation with the planet.

Jacobi1981 wrote:

Idunno wrote:There is one little problem that I have with this . It requires a leveling system . Having a leveling system for an open world, single player game is not my idea of fun .

why is it that you think it "needs" a leveling system?
I will leave the implementation of this kinda thing to the experts, but i do have alternatives to leveling.
Maybe its a simple trigger, the tutorial only appears for the first hour of gameplay.
Maybe its a trigger, you get asked "want to take the tutorial?" yes, no...
Maybe you gain proficiency with the things you do as a pilot, mine a lot? gain proficiency in mining. the tutorial quests go away after you gain some experience in a few different areas.
Maybe instead of a tutorial its more like the beginning steps to gain trust/reputation/faith whatever. the "tutorial" only appears when you have no reputation with the planet.

I'm fine with it not being a leveling system . The proficiency thing sounds a lot like leveling to me . The tutorials being the beginning of your own network of associates is an idea that sound pretty nice. And unique .

Idunno wrote:

Jacobi1981 wrote:

Idunno wrote:There is one little problem that I have with this . It requires a leveling system . Having a leveling system for an open world, single player game is not my idea of fun .

why is it that you think it "needs" a leveling system?
I will leave the implementation of this kinda thing to the experts, but i do have alternatives to leveling.
Maybe its a simple trigger, the tutorial only appears for the first hour of gameplay.
Maybe its a trigger, you get asked "want to take the tutorial?" yes, no...
Maybe you gain proficiency with the things you do as a pilot, mine a lot? gain proficiency in mining. the tutorial quests go away after you gain some experience in a few different areas.
Maybe instead of a tutorial its more like the beginning steps to gain trust/reputation/faith whatever. the "tutorial" only appears when you have no reputation with the planet.

I'm fine with it not being a leveling system . The proficiency thing sounds a lot like leveling to me . The tutorials being the beginning of your own network of associates is an idea that sound pretty nice. And unique .

"leveling" is a tricky thing, even gaining partial points towared a level, or if your level isnt even able to be seen, its all the same thing, and its also extremely real in our everyday lives.
if you start a new job your not gonna be good at it immedietely, you must first be told how to do it, then memorize the procedure, further down the line you get better and better at it. until one day you look back and say... man i was such a noob!

Separate, pre-built tutorial accessible from the main menu, similarly how I have heard FTL does it. In the main game, you are on your own (except maybe for somekind of "cheat sheet").

Limit Theory is a procedurally generated sandbox game. You can't make starter missions for games like this, or tutorials. At best, you can give tips as to how you can start out, or perhaps a tree of "achievements" you can reach, to show you how far you've advanced in different directions. For the most part, the player will likely have to learn as they go along, and it will thus need to be intuitive.

It could be made considerably simpler if Mr. Parnell includes "help nodes" in his nodal UI system - nodes you click to expand a little block of text that says "This is how to shoot", "This is how to mine", "This is how to epic space battle", etc.

As a sandbox game it could include always a tweak for the starting star system, which make things easier for the beginner. Little to non piracy or only located in small pockets, some local economic challenges in the body of contracts, etc. A little tutorial for the basic controls and some directions could be also included. Beyond that... probably not.