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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#31
Sorry I didn't update with more words today :oops: honestly, I don't have a ton of words to say about the ships. I think they speak for themselves ^^ I hope y'all can forgive me! XD
Ship Inspiration Pinterest!! (send me stuff)

"You’ve got to work on something dangerous. You have to work on something that makes you uncertain. Something that makes you doubt yourself... because it stimulates you to do things you haven’t done before. The whole thing is if you know where you’re going, you’ve gone, as the poet says. And that’s death."
- Stephen Sondheim
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#32
LindseyReid wrote:
Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:34 pm
Sorry I didn't update with more words today :oops: honestly, I don't have a ton of words to say about the ships. I think they speak for themselves ^^ I hope y'all can forgive me! XD
A picture is worth at least a few million words going by the bit rate.
Don't worry, just post pretties. :V
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WebGL Spaceships and Trails
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#34
Holy shit guys. I mean. Holy. Shit. Where did we crash the hype train last time? We need to get that old boy up and running again. Great work Lindsey. Especially for such a short gestation period. :) Frankly, if I saw these ships in the game with trails, lights and good texturing, I wouldn't complain. But you sound like you're just starting out. Kudos to that. :D
Last edited by Vartul on Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#35
Wowzers. To clarify: are these being generated by our old friend, Mr. PRNG? Or are they hand-designed for now?

If procedural, that's fantastic -- it implies that the universe of ship types we encounter in LT v1.0 will be terrifically diverse.

I do have two pieces of feedback at a conceptual level, both of which are related to kostuek's comment: wings make sense for atmospheric flight.

1. Forward-facing wing surfaces that are flat are an offense to physics. :D If it really is a "wing," implying that this thing could fly well in an atmosphere, then there probably needs to be some logic to insure that the "front" part of any wing is an edge where two surfaces join.

2. Less wing, more fuselage. Unless Josh is still planning to support our landing on planets and showing a city through a window, where we might see some of these fighter craft flying, "wings" are completely unnecessary for a spacecraft in a vacuum.

They do sort of make sense aesthetically, though. The idea of a "fighter" craft immediately brings to mind the basic shapes in the drawing shown in the OP. So while some fighters might not have wings (maybe they are wings -- a "lifting body" design), it probably doesn't hurt to let some space fighters have wing-like attachments.

But in all the test images shown, the wing-to-fuselage ratio seems very excessive. I think (following Hyperion's perspective) that a great diversity of shapes means we ought to see more-wing-than-fuselage fighters from time to time. What I'm suggesting is that this should not be the norm, that most fighters probably ought to be mostly fuselage with a bit of wing.

That still leaves plenty of room for visual variation, but it also covers the feeling that a spaceship with a bunch of core systems (power, engine, weapons, shields, armor, sensors) would usually put those systems in a fuselage, so the fuselage needs to be proportionately larger compared to any wings. (We might note that wings may be hardpoint sites, but here we start to get into real-world aircraft design and that's probably taking this too far. ;) )

Overall, really happy with the progress here! If some variation on fuselage/wing proportions can be added, I think that would deliver considerable value.
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#36
And Flat's post reminded me that I should have posted a thank you for your contribution concerning ship styles Hyperion. It was a treat to see you had included Liberator in your examples. :thumbup: :D

In a game like LT aesthetics win hands down for me. Especially as we are aware that there will be plenty of scope for modifications to be made to the released game. :angel:
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#37
Flatfingers wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:10 am
Wowzers. To clarify: are these being generated by our old friend, Mr. PRNG? Or are they hand-designed for now?

If procedural, that's fantastic -- it implies that the universe of ship types we encounter in LT v1.0 will be terrifically diverse.
They are indeed procedural.

Flatfingers wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:10 am
I do have two pieces of feedback at a conceptual level, both of which are related to kostuek's comment: wings make sense for atmospheric flight.

1. Forward-facing wing surfaces that are flat are an offense to physics. :D If it really is a "wing," implying that this thing could fly well in an atmosphere, then there probably needs to be some logic to insure that the "front" part of any wing is an edge where two surfaces join.

2. Less wing, more fuselage. Unless Josh is still planning to support our landing on planets and showing a city through a window, where we might see some of these fighter craft flying, "wings" are completely unnecessary for a spacecraft in a vacuum.

They do sort of make sense aesthetically, though. The idea of a "fighter" craft immediately brings to mind the basic shapes in the drawing shown in the OP. So while some fighters might not have wings (maybe they are wings -- a "lifting body" design), it probably doesn't hurt to let some space fighters have wing-like attachments.

But in all the test images shown, the wing-to-fuselage ratio seems very excessive. I think (following Hyperion's perspective) that a great diversity of shapes means we ought to see more-wing-than-fuselage fighters from time to time. What I'm suggesting is that this should not be the norm, that most fighters probably ought to be mostly fuselage with a bit of wing.

That still leaves plenty of room for visual variation, but it also covers the feeling that a spaceship with a bunch of core systems (power, engine, weapons, shields, armor, sensors) would usually put those systems in a fuselage, so the fuselage needs to be proportionately larger compared to any wings. (We might note that wings may be hardpoint sites, but here we start to get into real-world aircraft design and that's probably taking this too far. ;) )

Overall, really happy with the progress here! If some variation on fuselage/wing proportions can be added, I think that would deliver considerable value.
Thank you for the feedback, I'll definitely use this. I see a lot of wings in the general fighter trope, but I 100% agree that there needs to be more possibility for very short wings.
Ship Inspiration Pinterest!! (send me stuff)

"You’ve got to work on something dangerous. You have to work on something that makes you uncertain. Something that makes you doubt yourself... because it stimulates you to do things you haven’t done before. The whole thing is if you know where you’re going, you’ve gone, as the poet says. And that’s death."
- Stephen Sondheim
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#38
Awesome Lindsey - those ships look interesting and cool!

They have something in common - a visual "culture" if you will.
Could there be distinct pallets of ship design algorithms to represent different "space cultures" (with different values/goals/philosophies expressed in the design)?
It may make recognizing ship classes through visual shorthands more difficult though ...

I keep dreaming of space gypsies (hunters and gathers?) with gobbled together and super colorful flotillas roaming around, picking up the pieces of crumbling empires, and meeting up once in a while for a giant party and swap meet ;)
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#39
Very nice work, Lindsey. I can't wait to see polished versions properly textured and touched up with your ... erm ... gribble algorithms? Now if there only was a badge for how many distinctive ships you've collected ... you gotta catch em all.

Also, the MAERSK cargo freighter from the collection is terrific XD
You cannot not communicate.
Paul Watzlawick - 1st Axiom
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#40
lobosan wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:53 am
I keep dreaming of space gypsies (hunters and gathers?) with gobbled together and super colorful flotillas roaming around, picking up the pieces of crumbling empires, and meeting up once in a while for a giant party and swap meet ;)
I love this idea! this would be amazing!
Image
Challenging your assumptions is good for your health, good for your business, and good for your future. Stay skeptical but never undervalue the importance of a new and unfamiliar perspective.
Imagination Fertilizer
Beauty may not save the world, but it's the only thing that can
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#41
That super impressive! Especially if you didn't cheery pick the result! Would you consider generating a video where you change the parameter at random and generate a new ship like every 10 second ? That a pretty good way to visualize the breadth of the possibility space of a generative algorithm, and it would allow to see if there is any bias repetition or something not explored. Also it should be pretty low effort to generate automatically, and of course it would be super cool!
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#42
nobb wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 4:07 pm
Would you consider generating a video where you change the parameter at random and generate a new ship like every 10 second ?
... Thats a super neat idea. Lindsey, you could setup a little version that regenerates the ship every 5 seconds or so, and rotates the ship around slowly.

Then you could stream that to the internet while you are away from the office. :V just set it up, and leave it overnight. :V
Come back to infinite happiness from the random denizens of the Forums and IRC :V
°˖◝(ಠ‸ಠ)◜˖°
WebGL Spaceships and Trails
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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Re: [Lindsey] Friday, December 15, 2017

#44
Silverware wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:07 pm
nobb wrote:
Sun Dec 17, 2017 4:07 pm
Would you consider generating a video where you change the parameter at random and generate a new ship like every 10 second ?
... Thats a super neat idea. Lindsey, you could setup a little version that regenerates the ship every 5 seconds or so, and rotates the ship around slowly.

Then you could stream that to the internet while you are away from the office. :V just set it up, and leave it overnight. :V
Come back to infinite happiness from the random denizens of the Forums and IRC :V
I personally think its a bit too soon for that, but after a reworking of textures and adding lights and more details, sounds great.
I think nobbs idea would be good though, maybe a 5-10 minute video? doesnt need voiceover, just generate, rotate, morph....Can ships these ships morph by changing their verts and such? Because seeing
Image
turn into
Image
would be amazing
Image
Challenging your assumptions is good for your health, good for your business, and good for your future. Stay skeptical but never undervalue the importance of a new and unfamiliar perspective.
Imagination Fertilizer
Beauty may not save the world, but it's the only thing that can

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