Doesn't Voxel Farm have CSG?
Wait, I just checked, actually it doesn't. But the creator seems to have solved the same problem using different tools (using L- systems I think?). Here are some blog posts he's made that discuss his approach-
Video with spherical subtraction- https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... nbUoU_UIaM
Some blog posts where he answers comments about CSG-
https://procworld.blogspot.in/2012/04/r ... angle.html
https://procworld.blogspot.in/2012/08/p ... hapes.html
Are these any help Josh?
Post
Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:35 am
#93
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Thanks for the various replies on CSG
@Silverware: That sounds very interesting, I will try to have a look at what they're doing. If UE4 is using it for serious stuff they must have a robust and performant solution...!
@Vartul: Voxel Farm is using volumetric CSG & surface extraction. That's how I would do it right now if I needed an asteroid base, for example. The reason Miguel's solution might actually work for a complex cave through an asteroid is that he's developed literally the most advanced voxel tech in existence. His magic is in his ability to compute & store fields incredibly quickly + his ability to extract surfaces that are higher-quality (because he's using Dual Contouring IIRC, not a simple technique like Marching Cubes or Surface Nets). So TL;DR: it's not really an option for LT. He's spent many years building that tech (a whole engine around it); it's not just a new algorithm for CSG or anything. And the L-systems are used for generating procedural geometry, not for CSG
(Yes, I keep up with that guy, he's on the 'best of the best' list in my head)
@Astearon: Sadly not an option. Several problems: abandoned, using C++ (11 ), using arbitrary-precision numeric libraries (GMP). Biggest problem being that it's incomplete/abandoned
@Silverware: That sounds very interesting, I will try to have a look at what they're doing. If UE4 is using it for serious stuff they must have a robust and performant solution...!
@Vartul: Voxel Farm is using volumetric CSG & surface extraction. That's how I would do it right now if I needed an asteroid base, for example. The reason Miguel's solution might actually work for a complex cave through an asteroid is that he's developed literally the most advanced voxel tech in existence. His magic is in his ability to compute & store fields incredibly quickly + his ability to extract surfaces that are higher-quality (because he's using Dual Contouring IIRC, not a simple technique like Marching Cubes or Surface Nets). So TL;DR: it's not really an option for LT. He's spent many years building that tech (a whole engine around it); it's not just a new algorithm for CSG or anything. And the L-systems are used for generating procedural geometry, not for CSG
(Yes, I keep up with that guy, he's on the 'best of the best' list in my head)
@Astearon: Sadly not an option. Several problems: abandoned, using C++ (11 ), using arbitrary-precision numeric libraries (GMP). Biggest problem being that it's incomplete/abandoned
“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.” ~ Henry Ford
Post
Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:24 am
#94
Thanks for the reply anyway Josh. I have been following his blog for many years too. It's incredible what he's managed alone. I hear he has a team now though.
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Whoops, that's what happens when one is insufficiently nerdy.JoshParnell wrote: @Vartul: And the L-systems are used for generating procedural geometry, not for CSG
Thanks for the reply anyway Josh. I have been following his blog for many years too. It's incredible what he's managed alone. I hear he has a team now though.
Post
Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:18 pm
#95
It'll be a slog, but if you REALLY want to get CSG shit done, then it'll be totally worth it.
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Unreal has had it in since the first version iirc.JoshParnell wrote:@Silverware: That sounds very interesting, I will try to have a look at what they're doing. If UE4 is using it for serious stuff they must have a robust and performant solution...!
It'll be a slog, but if you REALLY want to get CSG shit done, then it'll be totally worth it.
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
Post
Tue Mar 21, 2017 2:51 pm
#96
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
I don't think CSG is planned for LT 1.0.
Have a question? Send me a PM! || I have a Patreon page up for REKT now! || People talking in IRC over the past two hours:
Post
Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:38 am
#97
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Hooray!! :)JoshParnell wrote:Fun UI times are not over :)
Post
Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:55 pm
#98
Then I expect he actually intended to use it along with platemeshes for his ship construction and asteroid stuff.
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
No, but if you look at how dejected he seemed in his message about how he couldn't get it to work they way he wanted to...Talvieno wrote:I don't think CSG is planned for LT 1.0.
Then I expect he actually intended to use it along with platemeshes for his ship construction and asteroid stuff.
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
Post
Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:07 pm
#99
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Josh never intended to use it as part of a real-time damage mechanic for either ships or asteroids. He did, however, intend to use it for creating asteroid bases and carriers. He couldn't find it, though, and eventually seemed to abandon it.
Have a question? Send me a PM! || I have a Patreon page up for REKT now! || People talking in IRC over the past two hours:
Post
Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:27 pm
#100
The best way to handle damage is two model layers, Armor and Structure, and dynamic transparency and decals for damage.
Gives you the look of losing armor and showing substructure, without dynamic model changes which are FAR more expensive.
I would however expect him to use it in his ship generation, as it allows him to form single meshes, although with triangles being basically random, it wouldn't take to the method above so well. Dynamic textures on multiple tris that are not hand crafted is a hard problem.
Hopefully UE4 has some stuff he can make use of, I can see some massive gains in visual quality of models if he does manage it.
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Who said anything about damage?Talvieno wrote:Josh never intended to use it as part of a real-time damage mechanic for either ships or asteroids. He did, however, intend to use it for creating asteroid bases and carriers. He couldn't find it, though, and eventually seemed to abandon it.
The best way to handle damage is two model layers, Armor and Structure, and dynamic transparency and decals for damage.
Gives you the look of losing armor and showing substructure, without dynamic model changes which are FAR more expensive.
I would however expect him to use it in his ship generation, as it allows him to form single meshes, although with triangles being basically random, it wouldn't take to the method above so well. Dynamic textures on multiple tris that are not hand crafted is a hard problem.
Hopefully UE4 has some stuff he can make use of, I can see some massive gains in visual quality of models if he does manage it.
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
Post
Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:09 am
#101
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
Life goalsJoshParnell wrote:he's on the 'best of the best' list in my head
Post
Fri Mar 24, 2017 4:56 pm
#102
and both of you have developed some amazing and unique game engines.
Re: Friday, March 17, 2017
I remember years ago, I started following you and Miguel around the same week.JoshParnell wrote:Thanks for the various replies on CSG
....
@Vartul: Voxel Farm is using volumetric CSG & surface extraction. That's how I would do it right now if I needed an asteroid base, for example. The reason Miguel's solution might actually work for a complex cave through an asteroid is that he's developed literally the most advanced voxel tech in existence. His magic is in his ability to compute & store fields incredibly quickly + his ability to extract surfaces that are higher-quality (because he's using Dual Contouring IIRC, not a simple technique like Marching Cubes or Surface Nets). So TL;DR: it's not really an option for LT. He's spent many years building that tech (a whole engine around it); it's not just a new algorithm for CSG or anything. And the L-systems are used for generating procedural geometry, not for CSG
...
and both of you have developed some amazing and unique game engines.
"A sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
- Arthur C. Clarke
- Arthur C. Clarke