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Pick the next president...

Poll ended at Mon Nov 07, 2016 10:52 am You may select 1 option

Hillary Clinton
Total votes: 8 (32%)
Donald J. Trump
Total votes: 14 (56%)
Gary Johnson
Total votes: 2 (8%)
Jill Stein
Total votes: 1 (4%)
Total votes: 25
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Re: American Election 2016

#32
DigitalDuck wrote:
Detritus wrote:
IronDuke wrote: Now, if Tal were to run...
He would get a vote. Just one. :squirrel: :ghost:
I'm pretty sure he'd vote for himself as well.
Nathan would never make a politician. He's too honest and decent for that game. I wouldn't vote for him...the whole experience would destroy him. :angel:
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Re: American Election 2016

#33
I've voted in every presidential election since George Bush in 88. I voted Democrat until 2000. Since then the Democrats no longer represent my views nor do I believe that they have my best interest in mind (I'm a white, Caucasian male). In national elections all they do is pander to minorities and then turn around and do nothing to help them. I shouldn't say "nothing". They give give give from the working class which does not help the poorest of communities. Manufacturing jobs need to come back to this country, people need to work which in turn will instill dignity and give them a sense of hope and purpose.

Hillary plans on upping the corporate tax rate which is already among the highest in the world. This is why our GDP is %1 or lower and why we have a deficit nearing 20 Trillion. Since George Bush in 2000 the deficit has increased nearly 16 Trillion. Obama's term accounts for over half that. ACA (Obamacare) is going to bankrupt this country and Hillary is planning on adding to it along with other social programs. She's going to tax us into nothingness. On top of that she wants to let in 5 times more immigrants from the war torn middle east. The FBI has already said they cannot vet these people. Why would we want those problems in our country? I know she feels guilty for creating the mess in the first place but it needs to be fixed over there and considering her past track record in that department I doubt she's the one for the job. Add on Benghazi, unsecured email, wikileaks, interfering with Trump rallies, FBI payoffs, Whitewater, Pay to Play...etc and you get a trail of corruption that spans decades.

I know Trump is unrefined and not the typical politician. He's done things in his life he's not proud of like most of us. He also tends to scare people because he actually answers questions asked of him instead of dodging them like a typical politician. When you answer questions you alienate people who disagree with you. We've become programmed all our lives on what a politician is supposed to be so we naturally dislike anyone different.

I do agree with others that it is truly pathetic that all we are left with is these two. I know there are 3rd party candidates out there but a vote for one of them is a wasted vote in our current political system. We need true political reform in this country where a viable 3rd party candidate might actually have a chance. The republican party had 17 candidates running, if it had been whittled down to 3-4 prior to the state primary's we might have a different candidate. On the other hand you have Hillary who lost a good number of state primary's to Berny Sandars but still carried those states due to how the DNC determines voting. I dont know how we go about changing this system, it'll probably take another revolution. The first step is to remove those in power and put in place a system where our elected representatives no longer become lifetime politicians. They should have to rely on the same economy they create and the rest of us have to live with. Take away their benefits and bloated salaries. We need politicians that want to go to Washington to make a difference in the lives of their constituents, not to make it rich.
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Re: American Election 2016

#34
(First, in case anyone missed it, I'm not American, I am about to give my opinion on things as someone who views it from the outside)
Tylon wrote:I've voted in every presidential election since George Bush in 88. I voted Democrat until 2000. Since then the Democrats no longer represent my views nor do I believe that they have my best interest in mind (I'm a white, Caucasian male). In national elections all they do is pander to minorities and then turn around and do nothing to help them. I shouldn't say "nothing". They give give give from the working class which does not help the poorest of communities. Manufacturing jobs need to come back to this country, people need to work which in turn will instill dignity and give them a sense of hope and purpose.
It's a shame there can't be a middle ground. Republicans scare people because they tend to push the "white male, Christian and straight" agenda. It's difficult to sell a political party to the mass make up as a country as diverse as the United States when you appear to only represent a part of it. It's something that has cost the them massive ground.
Manufacturing jobs are leaving first world countries because it's just way cheaper to build stuff and pay for the shipping from poorer countries. There is no easy solution to this other than just outlawing the importing of goods or placing such high import taxes that no one bothers. Either solution forces America into a trade bubble within it's self. In the modern world a country just cannot survive this. I'm not saying nothing should be done to work on this issue, but there is no easy or quick solution to it.
Tylon wrote:Hillary plans on upping the corporate tax rate which is already among the highest in the world. This is why our GDP is %1 or lower and why we have a deficit nearing 20 Trillion. Since George Bush in 2000 the deficit has increased nearly 16 Trillion. Obama's term accounts for over half that. ACA (Obamacare) is going to bankrupt this country and Hillary is planning on adding to it along with other social programs. She's going to tax us into nothingness. On top of that she wants to let in 5 times more immigrants from the war torn middle east. The FBI has already said they cannot vet these people. Why would we want those problems in our country? I know she feels guilty for creating the mess in the first place but it needs to be fixed over there and considering her past track record in that department I doubt she's the one for the job. Add on Benghazi, unsecured email, wikileaks, interfering with Trump rallies, FBI payoffs, Whitewater, Pay to Play...etc and you get a trail of corruption that spans decades.
Coming from a country that has universal health care, to say America needs to modernize it's health care system is an understatement. The fact that more than curable diseases kill people because they just don't have the money to do so is a horrible state to be in. The fact that a large part of the population is an accident away from bankruptcy is sad. Perhaps the ACA isn't the perfect solution. Even democrats admit it needs tweaking. However, the change needed to start somewhere. The American deficit also has decreased most years Obama has been in control. (other than his last year?)

As far as immigrants go, unless you are a pure blood native, someone in your blood line at some point immigrated to America while others lived there already. I understand the fear of letting in possible terrorists. However, understand that you live in country built (and taken over by) immigrants. Just because the current batch don't look like you, or believe your exact beliefs doesn't mean they should be blocked. I understand the issue with taking in people from a war torn area, but it's the very fact they need to escape a war torn area in the first place they seek to come there. Don't get me wrong, you didn't present your fear of letting them in because they are different, but understand there are already a ton of people already in the US that want to do harm. If a few slip in, but save the lives of many more innocents, is it possibly worth it?

The whole email and Benghazi thing, though was a blunder, has been blown WAY out of proportion.

Tylon wrote:I know Trump is unrefined and not the typical politician. He's done things in his life he's not proud of like most of us. He also tends to scare people because he actually answers questions asked of him instead of dodging them like a typical politician. When you answer questions you alienate people who disagree with you. We've become programmed all our lives on what a politician is supposed to be so we naturally dislike anyone different.
Trump just says what ever he thinks the current people in the room want to hear. Afterwards when questioned on why he said something, he will often just say he didn't say it, even if it's recorded. There is nothing wrong with saying extreme things, just be prepared to back them afterwards.
Tylon wrote:I do agree with others that it is truly pathetic that all we are left with is these two. I know there are 3rd party candidates out there but a vote for one of them is a wasted vote in our current political system. We need true political reform in this country where a viable 3rd party candidate might actually have a chance.
Agreed.
I come from a country that has more than two federal political parties that actual have a chance. Though because our "congress" and "presidential" level are basically the same thing, it allows for "runner ups" to still hold political sway.
Tylon wrote:The republican party had 17 candidates running, if it had been whittled down to 3-4 prior to the state primary's we might have a different candidate. On the other hand you have Hillary who lost a good number of state primary's to Berny Sandars but still carried those states due to how the DNC determines voting. I dont know how we go about changing this system, it'll probably take another revolution. The first step is to remove those in power and put in place a system where our elected representatives no longer become lifetime politicians. They should have to rely on the same economy they create and the rest of us have to live with. Take away their benefits and bloated salaries. We need politicians that want to go to Washington to make a difference in the lives of their constituents, not to make it rich.
If it was fair, Sandars should have won the nomination. He still could have ran as an independent but saw the threat Trump was, and backed down out of "greater good".
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Re: American Election 2016

#35
In the past immigrants have come to America because they respected the values of the United States and were inspired by the hope of creating a new future here. These current refuges largely do not respect the values of the United States and the European nations that they have entered. This is why women have been assaulted more often in Europe since the immigrants have come in.

It's not racist to be unwilling to bring in thousands of people into your country when they don't respect your citizens. Especially when some of them may have the goal of killing a large number of the citizens.
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Re: American Election 2016

#36
BFett wrote:In the past immigrants have come to America because they respected the values of the United States and were inspired by the hope of creating a new future here.
Many Native Americans would have to disagree.
BFett wrote: These current refuges largely do not respect the values of the United States and the European nations that they have entered. This is why women have been assaulted more often in Europe since the immigrants have come in.
Evidence?
BFett wrote: It's not racist to be unwilling to bring in thousands of people into your country when they don't respect your citizens. Especially when some of them may have the goal of killing a large number of the citizens.
Again, source? Evidence?

Granted, some may have ill intent. However, people from all over the world come to different countries with ill intent. If thousands of innocent lives can be saved does it perhaps justify it?
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Re: American Election 2016

#39
BFett wrote:Native Americans did not create the US nor did they immegrate into the US and request citizenship. A lack of education and technology lead to their downfall.

I am open to some good historical articles on the subject though. Feel free to educate me.
But they had nations of their own. What would they want with the white guys' nation? :think:
Besides, one of the nations tried to integrate and do it the European way, but then President Jackson did his thing. He flew in the face of the rest of the government while doing it, too, which provides precedent for fears of Trump.

Do note that, although I am American, I am not of voting age. Therefore, I haven't read as much about the subject as I might otherwise.
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Re: American Election 2016

#40
As above, plus the Natives were struck down by several epidemics. Some of which happened before White Settlement, it was basically post-apocalyptic for them.

Then White Man came, and fucked shit up, because they brought the wars between the English, French, and Spanish to America.

And as we can see with the Middle East, when White Man brings his wars with other White Men, bad shit happens to the natives.



Also, I believe most immigrants respect the values the US was founded on, which is FAR more than we can say about most natural born Americans. Who believe only in the power of the Dollar, and in Jingoistic Patriotism.
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WebGL Spaceships and Trails
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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Re: American Election 2016

#42
IronDuke wrote:If life in America ever becomes untenable, then I'll probably emigrate. :(
Anyone know much about Switzerland? :think: :angel:

--IronDuke
A childhood friend of mine lives there, you have to learn 2/3 languages.

Come to New Zealand instead, we have more sheep than people. :D
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WebGL Spaceships and Trails
<Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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Re: American Election 2016

#45
Grumblesaur wrote:The numbers in this poll have been slowly rising in perfect lock-step with each other.
I can't even bring myself to look at the results. Too depressing.

And I certainly can't vote for any of the options currently offered in this poll, any more than any of those people are getting my vote in the actual election. (Because long-term principle > short-term power.)

Sigh.

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