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Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:20 am
by Zanteogo
Damocles wrote:
Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:02 am
Another variant could have been to call the FULL TIME development quits .. understandable after such a long delay without money flowing back in. Not (promise) to release the code.
Get a new job and keep the project on the backburner.
I was thinking this, but at the full time rate Josh would have been lucky to get the game out after ten years. (if the money didn't stop him)

Working on it part time, he would have to will it to his kids to finish.

I wouldn't be surprised if he does this any ways. Just working on bit of it on the side as a hobby. I don't expect to see any thing about it or certainly don't expect a game to come of it.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:50 am
by Damocles
Maybe working in a company with deadlines, milestones and projects plans would transfer over to his own approach at the project after some time...

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:36 am
by BFett
In essence technical feature creep was what killed LT. Modding was not supposed to be in LT, and in the end, this is what I think prevented the game from releasing. I'm not a programmer though so I could be wrong there. I just think that if Josh had worked on getting gameplay worked out, just as he had while he was doing work on the prototype, LT would have released at least a year ago.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:01 pm
by Philip Coutts
BFett wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:36 am
In essence technical feature creep was what killed LT. Modding was not supposed to be in LT, and in the end, this is what I think prevented the game from releasing. I'm not a programmer though so I could be wrong there. I just think that if Josh had worked on getting gameplay worked out, just as he had while he was doing work on the prototype, LT would have released at least a year ago.
Pretty much this I think. Look at the state of Star Citizen with it's mega budget and hundreds of staff. Still nowhere near a finished game because they keep adding more and more stuff instead of actually finishing what they have.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:51 pm
by RedDwarfMining
Red Dead Redemption had a staff of 800! and that took 5 years. Red Dead 2 has taken 8 years and they have 2,000 + employees. I'd like to see Rockstar try a space game...but even they would take 8-10 years.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:51 pm
by Silverware
RedDwarfMining wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:51 pm
Red Dead Redemption had a staff of 800! and that took 5 years. Red Dead 2 has taken 8 years and they have 2,000 + employees. I'd like to see Rockstar try a space game...but even they would take 8-10 years.
Um, fairly sure those numbers are for Rockstar or Activision in total, not the specific studios...

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 12:38 am
by Damocles
GTA5 generated about $6 Billion! in revenue overall. A high staff is kind of warranted here. It can be compared more to big movie productions or TV series nowadays.

With this kind of investment (and proven game core mechanic) they also will always release that product.

They would not have invested that much into an unproven "core gameplay". New types of genres usually start way smaller.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2018 9:18 am
by Zanteogo
BFett wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 11:36 am
In essence technical feature creep was what killed LT. Modding was not supposed to be in LT, and in the end, this is what I think prevented the game from releasing. I'm not a programmer though so I could be wrong there. I just think that if Josh had worked on getting gameplay worked out, just as he had while he was doing work on the prototype, LT would have released at least a year ago.
LT failed because Josh spent too much time trying to find eloquent solutions and not just a solution that worked. (until it was too late)

LT failed because Josh didn't have a plan, and when he did he didn't stick to it.

LT failed because when it became clear this was too much, he didn't cut out features. Sure having half of what LT was supposed to be would have sucked, but now we get nothing at all.

LT failed because Josh spent too much time treating this like his school experiment and not like a project he agreed to create after taking peoples money.

LT failed because Josh's support structure, (eg this forum), kept telling him that everything was alright and nothing was wrong. (other than the few of us who actually questioned things)

That all being said, I don't believe for a second there was any malice on his part. Quite a bit of young inexperience and too much wishful thinking.. yes.

Maybe he will give it another go in ten years or so. (edit: though he almost certainly won't, people don't get any hopes up)

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2018 5:29 pm
by zircher
I'm still of the mind set that I would rather see ugly code than idle speculation. I fix code, that's what a lot of us do either as a hobby or a paid gig. But, you have to have something to work with in order to make any progress.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 6:16 pm
by kaeroku
Philip Coutts wrote:
Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:01 pm
Look at the state of Star Citizen with it's mega budget and hundreds of staff. Still nowhere near a finished game because they keep adding more and more stuff instead of actually finishing what they have.
It's not a leap of logic to consider Star Citizen vaporware at this point. They've continued to accumulate *massive* funding for very little return. Yeah, there's a lot of staff now. A lot of people suckling at the SC-crowdfunding tit. But even accounting for salaries, office space, and hardware, there's a lot of millions in CR's pocket. Lots of folks aren't disillusioned yet; they want to believe, just like we all did in LT. But nobody should be surprised if Mr. Roberts just walks away, assuming he hasn't already. He's got enough to retire on several times over, and can leave development to staff, to succeed, fail, or endlessly iterate on a product which will never release (thus ensuring their own job security,) as they please.

@zantego: agreed with all of the above.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:04 pm
by kaeroku
A month past the announcement of project cancellation and still no actual news on whether the source code is going to be released or not?

Beginning to end, the lack of transparency and forthcoming in this project is an enormous disappointment.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:18 pm
by Talvieno
kaeroku wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:04 pm
Beginning to end, the lack of transparency and forthcoming in this project is an enormous disappointment.
Simply put, this is false. Josh has been far, far more transparent than the great majority of video game developers - even if we entirely exclude anything made by AAA companies. Tunic, for instance, has released exactly two updates in the past year, and only to those that subscribed to their mailing list. This is not at all unusual! While Josh has certainly had such periods of silence, they were by far not the norm.

Adding up all of Josh's announcement/update/devlog posts, we have...
  • 50 Announcement topics
  • 53 post-silence topics
  • 834 daily devlog posts
...for a total of 937 updates - not counting Kickstarter posts he didn't announce on the forums, of which there were many, or counting Elder Council posts, or any of the other 3,000+ posts he's made on the forum.

Five years and 9 months is about 2099 days. So, 937 over 2099 days?

That's an average of one post every 2.2 days.


Be patient. He will release it when it's ready.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:33 pm
by Flatfingers
Talvieno wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:18 pm
Adding up all of Josh's announcement/update/devlog posts, we have...
  • 50 Announcement topics
  • 53 post-silence topics
  • 834 daily devlog posts
...for a total of 937 updates - not counting Kickstarter posts he didn't announce on the forums, of which there were many, or counting Elder Council posts, or any of the other 3,000+ posts he's made on the forum.

Five years and 9 months is about 2099 days. So, 937 over 2099 days?

That's an average of one post every 2.2 days.

Be patient. He will release it when it's ready.

This is very well said. Thank you.

It's also true that, at the time I write this, it's been nearly two months since Josh announced The End of his development of Limit Theory.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:25 am
by CSE
Flatfingers wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 9:33 pm
Talvieno wrote:
Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:18 pm
Adding up all of Josh's announcement/update/devlog posts, we have...
  • 50 Announcement topics
  • 53 post-silence topics
  • 834 daily devlog posts
...for a total of 937 updates - not counting Kickstarter posts he didn't announce on the forums, of which there were many, or counting Elder Council posts, or any of the other 3,000+ posts he's made on the forum.

Five years and 9 months is about 2099 days. So, 937 over 2099 days?

That's an average of one post every 2.2 days.

Be patient. He will release it when it's ready.

This is very well said. Thank you.

It's also true that, at the time I write this, it's been nearly two months since Josh announced The End of his development of Limit Theory.
Yes. And while I don’t mind him taking his time to rebuilt his objectives and plans, I do worry if the silence could be a new dark time... i sure hope he is doing well.

Re: Where to be notified about code release, and any fan-based projects to bring LT-like games to life using code?

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:58 pm
by Talvieno
I do too. I wish he would get in contact with us again, at least so we would know he was okay.