I would like to request a refund for my pledge. I'm not going to go into the details why as these have clearly been covered many times on the forum.

I have tried to contact Josh by email, kickstarter message, forum messages with no response so this is a last resort.

Josh - please respond to my messages which include the relevant details.
Thanks

Edit by Talvieno: The transfer has been approved and is underway. The relevant negotiations will be carried out in private.

eddy999 wrote:I would like to request a refund for my pledge. I'm not going to go into the details why as these have clearly been covered many times on the forum.

I have tried to contact Josh by email, kickstarter message, forum messages with no response so this is a last resort.

Josh - please respond to my messages which include the relevant details.

Thanks

Ohh What pledge? Can I refund you for the pledge? :V

How did you pay for your pledge? It may be that going through your credit card company or paypal will be easier? Might not be just trying to help.

Unfortunately I think we are going to start seeing more of this kind of post / thread.

It was a $75 kickstarter pledge taken through Amazon Payments.. $75 was for the prototype plus beta etc - i've had the prototype so would be happy with just the $60 for the outstanding beta/game etc. I'd be happy to sell the pledge instead if that could be agreed although Josh would need to be involved (and we haven't seen him for a month).

Philip Coutts wrote: Unfortunately I think we are going to start seeing more of this kind of post / thread.

Equally, there would be plenty of people willing to purchase pledges who missed the chance to back the project via kickstarter.. Myself included.

FormalMoss wrote:

Philip Coutts wrote: Unfortunately I think we are going to start seeing more of this kind of post / thread.

Equally, there would be plenty of people willing to purchase pledges who missed the chance to back the project via kickstarter.. Myself included.

Yup, I backed at the lowest level to get the game, I would happily up my pledge to beta access but that's me. As the OP says that kind of transaction would need Josh to okay it.

What I really wouldn't like to see is the debacle of refund handling that both Frontier and at present Star citizen are going through, it just all gets really messy and splinters the community.

eddy999: I'll see what I can do.

I may have said this before but... I understand that people want refunds and their reasoning behind it, and this is not ment as bashing on those that want a refund. Yet, it leaves no good taste in my mouth. Contrary to Frontier and CIG, Josh have had no income on this project outside the Kickstarter sum and possibly support from his family. Given the time he have put into the project, that money is all spent. On food, housing, diet coke and power to his computer.

There is no million dollar bank account sitting there just waiting to refund unhappy backers. Which means, if all backers were to claim a refund, that would leave Josh with a serious debt. I don't want that for Josh, that's not why I backed his project. My pledge enabled Josh to eat while trying to build his/our procedural universe. If he should fail, I don't want that food back, if you catch my drift

Oh well, as long as there are others that want to "adopt" pledges we will all be fine

I'm starting to think it might be helpful to set up a "pledge transfer clearinghouse."

This would be a Josh-approved process for connecting people who want refunds on LT with people who would have liked to back LT during its Kickstarter run.

Of course I'd prefer that no one would want to ask for a refund, particularly on what is clearly billed as a speculative funding system. But I also believe that if you treat customers with respect, even when you can't give them what they want, most of them will trust you with future business. Letting people who want refunds and people willing to pay for pledges both get what they want seems like a responsible and beneficial solution (until LT is released).

Assuming Josh approves, would anyone be willing and able to coordinate these exchange requests?

(Note: none of this is a hidden criticism of Josh. It's exactly what it appears to be: an attempt to find a way for a problem and an opportunity to solve each other.)

@pliellevold At risk of ruffling feathers, I will speak my mind. Josh's inability to deliver this game anywhere near on time is no one's fault but his own unfortunately. I realize that there were obstacles along the way, but I think we can all agree that many things could have been handled better. A factor that must be taken into account on any project is the projected length and the funds it will take to remain in development for that period of time. Every project has an optimum development time, the space in between where "rush costs" (costs associated with moving the project along very quickly, ex. overtime) are too high and the "delay" costs that accrue in excess when the project goes on longer than it should (office space, wages, cost of living, in this case refunds, the costs of your technology falling behind your competition, etc.). Either Josh far underestimated the length of time it would take to develop this game, or he hasn't used his time as efficiently as needed in order to meet the goal he set, or maybe even some combination of both. I can't blame backers for wanting a refund, because if I were them I would want one too. I understand your desire for altruism, however the backers already did Josh a great service by essentially putting a down payment on this game and unfortunately he hasn't lived up to his end of the bargain. While I'm sure that some backers gave out of some altruistic desire, the end goal was to see a game get made, not to support Josh's livelihood for 3+ years.

The unfortunate reality for Josh is that this game isn't going to be as dazzling as it would have been had it been released over a year ago. Now, similar space sims are flooding the market and this game is at risk of being out-of-date when it launches. Every time a new space sim comes out, it cuts into the sales that this game will potentially garner. I realize most of the people here will be surefire buyers of the game and are loyal to the project, but the people in this forum would also likely be a small minority of the people who purchase this game (at least that's what I hope, if this thing doesn't get done relatively soon, that could change). I understand the sentiment that people want "this game to be done right no matter how much time it takes", however I don't believe that is a philosophy that works well in a situation where your competition is evolving and improving as you keep working endlessly on your project.

There are no similar space sims around or about to be around in the near future, AFAIK. Other space sims, yes. Similar or nearly similar. I don't think so. Just saying.

Anyway, I like the way this topic is getting handled so far.

Jeez, Developer, a few lines of text every month or such about how or if things are going would really help to keep all this mess down. You would not fall apart by posting a few lines every 4-6 weeks, would you?

@Lum I know the words No Man's Sky are swear words when used together on this forum, but I would say a space sim with a procedurally created universe is fairly similar, even if it is online. Also, there's games like Helium Rain, Star Citizen (another swear word), EVE Valkyrie, etc. coming. While you may recognize the differences, you are also ranked as a Vice Admiral on this forum and I'm guessing you will buy the game no matter what. I'm talking about the people who aren't here on this forum. These are the people who are going to look at LT and compare it with other games and deciding which to purchase, and the longer this project goes on the more I see LT being the loser in those comparisons unfortunately.

He was last online nearly a month ago now. To be fair I would rather he spend time on the game than read the forums here at this point. I've effectively put this game in the same box that Cube World is in. Similar situation too funnily enough, one release years ago and then nothing. Hopefully something will come out in the near future for both. I just hope the OS we are running at that time will run it.

We don't really mind No Man's Sky too much. Elite Dangerous is the one that tends to draw our ire because of what they did with their single player promise. No Man's Sky isn't much like LT anyway - it's focused around singular exploration instead of building empires. There's room for both.

I agree Josh should post more, though.