Kimny wrote:

As much as I disagree, that's a valid opinion as any - one that I am more than willing to respect instead of mock. Asking the same for those who think the opposite and dare to bring critiques to the table is not asking much, I think.

The problem isn't the critiques so much, as the fact they aren't anything new. It's the same old ones repeated endlessly over and over. Do you just like hearing yourself talk or what? You bring nothing new to the table. So why do you feel compelled to come in here and repeatedly voice the same concerns? For you they are valid. Okay, fine.

The question is, how long must we be subjugated to and endure, the same monotonous litany of complaints? I'm pretty sure Josh understands your view.

I for one, do not fall for the politically correct mind screw of couching malice behind fair words, who's only purpose are to deceive and imply that the speaker is so much wiser and tolerant, and that anyone who may gainsay him seems uncouth.

I for one, do not fall for the politically correct mind screw of couching malice behind fair words, who's only purpose are to deceive and imply that the speaker is so much wiser and tolerant, and that anyone who may gainsay him seems uncouth.

Huh, I'm actually in agreement with you here. To me it looks like Jason spoke his mind, though, right?

There are three options: Speak malice directly, couch it behind fair words (as you say), or simply don't use it. The most honourable ones are the first and third, but the best of all is the third. Isn't it?

Still, I don't think mockery of the kind that Lum did was acceptable. Whether or not it's better to speak your mind, if you still say something insulting, it's better not to say it. And, as Josh says, rules is rules.

Also, it's not like this forum is under constant, unceasing bombardment from people critical of the game. There's also a difference between criticising the game in February 2015, May 2015, and December 2015, since obviously the game was in different positions each of those times.

Yeah, I would agree with that. Goes along with another old adage.


If you have nothing good to say, don't say anything. Although, it also depends on context.

And while Jason may have spoken his mind, the question of whether he should have is debatable, but at least he was honest and forthright for the most part.

Personally, I am extremely leery of anyone who tries to sugar coat their words. It usually means they are trying to conceal something.

Scytale wrote:

I for one, do not fall for the politically correct mind screw of couching malice behind fair words, who's only purpose are to deceive and imply that the speaker is so much wiser and tolerant, and that anyone who may gainsay him seems uncouth.

Huh, I'm actually in agreement with you here. To me it looks like Jason spoke his mind, though, right?

There are three options: Speak malice directly, couch it behind fair words (as you say), or simply don't use it. The most honourable ones are the first and third, but the best of all is the third. Isn't it?

Well said, Poet and Scytale.

I just try my best to be polite and respectful to everyone. It's not an act, more a way of life that has rewarded me handsomely over the years.

Victor Tombs wrote: I just try my best to be polite and respectful to everyone. It's not an act, more a way of life that has rewarded me handsomely over the years.

Well, it's usually fairly obvious when someone is being a sneak vs. someone who is genuinely just being polite. There are times however, when you must call a spade a spade.

Poet1960 wrote:

Victor Tombs wrote: I just try my best to be polite and respectful to everyone. It's not an act, more a way of life that has rewarded me handsomely over the years.

Well, it's usually fairly obvious when someone is being a sneak vs. someone who is genuinely just being polite. There are times however, when you must call a spade a spade.

QFT

JoshParnell wrote:

Lum wrote:It's a sad trend: snowballing small things because no real reasons aside the own created ones.

It's okay to come once in a year to criticise the dev and the community, but laugh at it isn't. Noted. I'm out of here.

Lum, I wasn't speaking specifically to you...it was just a general PSA. I have no idea what was said on either side nor by whom. I just noticed this thread getting hot and glanced over what seemed to be a lot of person-on-person negativity, hence the PSA. It was directed at everybody and nobody in particular. I hope you mean out of the thread and not the forums

Yes, I was pretty critical of the LT development process in my first post. Mostly just frustration talking. Someone pointed out that I was being a jerk from the outset--I get that no one likes to hear criticism, but having some doesn't make me a jerk.

I DO however agree that for my part, I handled the mocking that ensued very poorly, and definitely owe everybody's whose feelings (or eyeballs) were offended an apology. In many years of posting on hundreds of different forums, I've never cracked like that before. It won't happen again.

And Josh, the fact that you took the time to personally sort out some forum nonsense is actually a more positive action than you know.

Live long and prosper, everybody.

The problem isn't the critiques so much, as the fact they aren't anything new. It's the same old ones repeated endlessly over and over. Do you just like hearing yourself talk or what? You bring nothing new to the table. So why do you feel compelled to come in here and repeatedly voice the same concerns? For you they are valid. Okay, fine.

The question is, how long must we be subjugated to and endure, the same monotonous litany of complaints? I'm pretty sure Josh understands your view.

I for one, do not fall for the politically correct mind screw of couching malice behind fair words, who's only purpose are to deceive and imply that the speaker is so much wiser and tolerant, and that anyone who may gainsay him seems uncouth.

Really man, "politically correct mind screw of couching malice"? That won't work. It's a zing provocation that I won't bite at as well. Nothing to do with being more or less wise (another provocation of yours), I just don't like that kind of debate. I won't engage on that, so feel free to stop whenever you are done with it.

Besides, I think you missed something, when provoking with the "Do you just like hearing yourself talk or what?" and "So why do you feel compelled to come in here and repeatedly voice the same concerns?" parts. Notice that I didn't post any critique-filled post recently. Actually I think I don't since the time I posted in that debate a couple of weeks ago where Josh replied with news about what he was doing. After that, at most I have endorsed one or other's comment with something like "Spot on" or "That is a good point". Yesterday and today, I posted a disagreement on how reactions started to raise against others' critiques. So you are targeting wrongly. Worse than that, in the current debate, the 3 other people who criticized something about LT were, as far as I remember, doing that for the first time in the thread. So, no, it is not true that someone is repeating the same stuff over again.

On the other hand, you might be correct, indeed, that the same sort of critiques are being / will start being repeated - although from different people and with different angles. But that's an entirely different thing. And not unexpected, given: 1) the subject of this thread; 2) the recent (yes, recent) emergence of more frequent critiques to LT's situation which opened the gates and indeed attracts new people criticizing; 3) and also given the passage of time, since it is usual to happen to late games that the more late they are, the more frequent to new people jumping into critiques.

Still, I don't think mockery of the kind that Lum did was acceptable. Whether or not it's better to speak your mind, if you still say something insulting, it's better not to say it. And, as Josh says, rules is rules.

Also, it's not like this forum is under constant, unceasing bombardment from people critical of the game. There's also a difference between criticising the game in February 2015, May 2015, and December 2015, since obviously the game was in different positions each of those times.

Exactly! Perfect points.

I just try my best to be polite and respectful to everyone. It's not an act, more a way of life that has rewarded me handsomely over the years.

Pretty awesome sentence of yours. Politeness and respect are always rewarding - if not for nothing, because makes everyone always feel welcome no matter what, in no matter which place or situation.

@Kimny

Who said it was a debate? All I see are opinions, and you know what they say about those.

^Come now, don't be disingenuous

Scytale wrote:^Come now, don't be disingenuous

I'm not. It is all pretty much opinions. There are no right or wrong answers. Each persons opinion is theirs and so therefore "right" for them. It's not a matter of who's right or wrong. It's a question of how much time do you really want to spend trying to "convince" others that your opinion is the "right" one.

I don't really care, I just get tired of all the beating down of a dead horse. At least come up with something original or new. I primarily only engage in this stuff as a way to entertain myself and watch how seriously some people take themselves and others. All the posturing and posing that goes on is rather comical yet sad at the same time, but...it's the internet.

...ok, but that means that attempting to converse with you in any meaningful way is pointless.

JoshParnell wrote:

On a brighter note:

Josh is now on 3931 posts;
Meaning we only need 69 more Joshposts to have a 4000th post celebration day!

Poet1960 wrote: ...... I primarily only engage in this stuff as a way to entertain myself and watch how seriously some people take themselves and others. All the posturing and posing that goes on is rather comical yet sad at the same time, but...it's the internet.

So, you are saying that you just adding fuel to a fire and watching from the sidelines not taking responsibility for the inferno you start?

I must admit Poet1960, I really dont understand your logic.

On a related topic:

It would be nice if the community as a whole could remember that they are a gathering of diverse but interested people, all here to see if the (some say) crazy dream of one man can actually come true or not.

We are not here to measure the size of our internet 3rd leg.

We are mostly here to see/experience what could become a very interesting piece of gaming history unfold.