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Fuel and ammo?

#1
Will their be a required fuel source? And on the subject of that how about ammo? WIll energy actually be used up or will it just be like a limit (i.e You have 500 watts, lights cost 5 per in-game hour, in 100 hours you would run out of power just running lights, or would it be you have 100 units of power, lights cost 5 units, guidance systems 50, AI 25, so you would be spending a total of 80 units, meaning that you could add another machine running 20 units and be ok indefinitely.)

Personally, I hope there is no fuel or ammo, and it uses the latter power method. This is the future, I imagine they found a renewable source of power by now.

P.S: Sorry if you can't understand my wording I have a hard time articulating myself
P.S.S: Sorry again, if this topic has already been posted, I couldn't find it
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#2
starpilotnpc wrote:Personally, I hope there is no fuel or ammo, and it uses the latter power method. This is the future, I imagine they found a renewable source of power by now.

P.S: Sorry if you can't understand my wording I have a hard time articulating myself
P.S.S: Sorry again, if this topic has already been posted, I couldn't find it
similar topics have been brought up but I cant blame you for not being able to find them XD.
from what i can remember from reading those topics though i dont think we will have to worry about fuel or ammo. and the later power you mentions also seems to be the leader in preferred power management. its also been the topic of 'best was to maintain balance' in a lot of places.
If I've rambled and gone off topic im sorry but i tend to be long winded as you might notice if you stumble across my other post XD. thanks for reading.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#3
Ammo hasn't really been talked about.

As for fuel? I as well as others have tossed up a few reasons why it could be considered, but like Dadalos said, there really hasn't been any one place. Main-ish threads for fuel discussion have cropped up in the following threads if you're curious to read what others have thought;

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=365
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=422
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=402

Going to keep this thread open in case others want to pitch in specifically for discussion on fuel and/or ammo instead of it being spread out.
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Early Spring - 1055: Well, I made it to Boatmurdered, and my initial impressions can be set forth in three words: What. The. F*ck.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#4
My Simple thoughts:

Fuel:
Sub-FTL - keep it simple no fuel. Acceleration and max speed based on simple engine power vs mass
Intra-system FTL - again keep it simple so you can putter around without worrying
Inter-system FTL - Jump drives, hyper drive, whatever - some kind of consumable that you need to mine/refine or purchase, or you have to use public facilities like jump gates, or hitching a ride with someone else.


Ammo:
Just power needed for pew pew lazers (lazers can then balance damage/Rate-of-fire/power use/heat capacity/capaciter recharge times/etc
Ammo needed for missiles, torpedoes, etc - requiring outfitting your ship with magazines to hold them and either buying or crafting the consumable ammo.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#5
I always liked having the option of a kinetic weapon like a Mass Driver (Descent series). Firing a hot slug at near the speed of light from a railgun would do massive hull damage with negligible to no damage vs. shields. Since it would be a downside to constantly have to buy ammo, it should have a decent trade off as well.
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Early Spring - 1055: Well, I made it to Boatmurdered, and my initial impressions can be set forth in three words: What. The. F*ck.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#6
Nerfherder wrote:My Simple thoughts:

Fuel:
Sub-FTL - keep it simple no fuel. Acceleration and max speed based on simple engine power vs mass
Intra-system FTL - again keep it simple so you can putter around without worrying
Inter-system FTL - Jump drives, hyper drive, whatever - some kind of consumable that you need to mine/refine or purchase, or you have to use public facilities like jump gates, or hitching a ride with someone else.


Ammo:
Just power needed for pew pew lazers (lazers can then balance damage/Rate-of-fire/power use/heat capacity/capaciter recharge times/etc
Ammo needed for missiles, torpedoes, etc - requiring outfitting your ship with magazines to hold them and either buying or crafting the consumable ammo.
I like this approach, it cuts down on micro-managing fleet supplies and is a lot like EVE. Although, in EVE lasors use an "ammo" (I put that in quotes cause it never really runs out), it uses frequency tuning crystals to change the type of damage dealt, and range of the lasors.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#7
On fuel i would like to see, a usage for FTL or jump engines like a Helium 3 or Hydrogen, and can be collected from gas giants, or bought. My reasoning is that exploring the universe, finding "fuel" would be fun to sell location, into lanes of travel.
As to weapons management,sheild management maybe a powerplant system of use. some projectiles can be small in caliber being shot out at high velocity thus impact would be greater and storage could be easily managable, instead of buyng the slivers(projectile) you buy a "block" of matter to use in projectile and the weapon system "cuts" the block to a specified size. this way the material could be minable too.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#8
DWMagus wrote:I always liked having the option of a kinetic weapon like a Mass Driver (Descent series). Firing a hot slug at near the speed of light from a railgun would do massive hull damage with negligible to no damage vs. shields. Since it would be a downside to constantly have to buy ammo, it should have a decent trade off as well.[/quote

Thanks for you help with the links and all, and I totally agree with the railgun idea.
Nerfherder wrote:Fuel:
Sub-FTL - keep it simple no fuel. Acceleration and max speed based on simple engine power vs mass
Intra-system FTL - again keep it simple so you can putter around without worrying
Inter-system FTL - Jump drives, hyper drive, whatever - some kind of consumable that you need to mine/refine or purchase, or you have to use public facilities like jump gates, or hitching a ride with someone else.


Ammo:
Just power needed for pew pew lazers (lazers can then balance damage/Rate-of-fire/power use/heat capacity/capaciter recharge times/etc
Ammo needed for missiles, torpedoes, etc - requiring outfitting your ship with magazines to hold them and either buying or crafting the consumable ammo.
I agree with you especially on the ammo part +1 man.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#9
in other parts of the forum weve already confirmed that Fuel wont be part of our worries. (whether or not it will still be a mine-able sell-able trade-able steal-able resource is in the air atm) as for ammo i see it being much the same. with perhaps the exception of something special. from most of the clips released for our endless enjoyment the weapons fired all apear in one form of other to be energy based be they a form of plasma fiery doom or hairpin lasers of searing death. in which case they would be powered directly from our energy core much like startrek phasers with the only appreciable ammo concerns being torpedoes (be they of plasma/quantum/temporal what-have you variety.) that im sure you can buy in bulk and not worry about till next time you make port.
If I've rambled and gone off topic im sorry but i tend to be long winded as you might notice if you stumble across my other post XD. thanks for reading.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#10
Dadalos wrote: they would be powered directly from our energy core much like startrek phasers
I completely agree about energy weapons, though maybe one item you can buy is a single-use rapid-discharge battery which can quickly recharge your capacitors if you run low in the midst of a slugging match, solving the problem of normal slower recharge.

Furthermore, won't we have available projectile weapons like missiles? Plus maybe short-range shrapnel guns and long range piercing shots? These should need reloads i.e. ammo must be carried. I may want my loadout to contain smart gloopy missiles that can fly up a target's engine pipe, detonate, and coat everything with sticky gloop that renders the engine unusable until a meticulous cleaning crew takes the time to de-gloop it. MY cleaning crew cleaning MY newly acquired ship.

Alternatively I may just want to blast my enemy full of HE holes so big you can fly an antenna-splayed scout ship through.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#11
There can be fuel and ammo management without turning the game into a micromanagement hell of trying to stock 3 brands of fuel and 50 different ammo and missile types that are compatible to your ships bought from 13 different factions.

Limited fuel and ammunition and the supply thereof
(since the post ended up being more suggestion-forum stuff, I moved it over)

It's less about how fuel could be used in the game but rather about how the results of this could be dealt with.
There is no "I" in Tea. That would be gross.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#13
DWMagus wrote:I always liked having the option of a kinetic weapon like a Mass Driver (Descent series). Firing a hot slug at near the speed of light from a railgun would do massive hull damage with negligible to no damage vs. shields. Since it would be a downside to constantly have to buy ammo, it should have a decent trade off as well.
Mass drivers = good.

Mass drivers that can pierce 100% shields = bad.

They weren't one of the most feared weapons in X for no reason. Not because of the damage they do, but the sheer hassle and money of hull repair just because some tiny fighter managed to get a couple of shots in your battleship.

So yes, a weapon like that will need serious balancing. Or leave in the massive hull damage, and remove shield pierce abilities.
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#14
jimhsu wrote:
DWMagus wrote:I always liked having the option of a kinetic weapon like a Mass Driver (Descent series). Firing a hot slug at near the speed of light from a railgun would do massive hull damage with negligible to no damage vs. shields. Since it would be a downside to constantly have to buy ammo, it should have a decent trade off as well.
Mass drivers = good.

Mass drivers that can pierce 100% shields = bad.

They weren't one of the most feared weapons in X for no reason. Not because of the damage they do, but the sheer hassle and money of hull repair just because some tiny fighter managed to get a couple of shots in your battleship.

So yes, a weapon like that will need serious balancing. Or leave in the massive hull damage, and remove shield pierce abilities.
I agree, I'm not so hot on the idea of "common man" weapons piercing shields. If you've got something that pierces a shield, it's going to be a real exotic treasure. Or maybe it won't exist at all. But I'm thinking there won't be piercing with your average, off-the-shelf mass-driver. Varying degrees of damage vs. hull/armor/shield, yes. But ability to completely ignore one? No thanks. You'll need to figure out a way to bring those shields down before you can reap the benefits of having a kinetic weapon.
“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.” ~ Henry Ford
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Re: Fuel and ammo?

#15
I always thought that when it came to kinetic weapons, they were useless against shields.

Why? A shield is energy-based. It works by dissipating extra energy. When you have an energy weapon hit a shield, it has to dissipate that energy or radiate it off in order to stay functioning. By applying too much energy, the shield either shuts down or becomes useless because it just can't absorb or dissipate any more energy.

If we use some hand waving and assume that a kinetic projectile has less energy than an energy projectile (plasma vs. mass driver) then it stands that kinetic energy is worthless against shields. Same argument against armor. You can't exactly destroy a ship by shining a flashlight on it. :lol:

But I digress. We already have a shields thread in suggestions.
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Early Spring - 1055: Well, I made it to Boatmurdered, and my initial impressions can be set forth in three words: What. The. F*ck.

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