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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#631
Talvieno wrote:Welcome to the forums, Swidhelm!!! :wave:

To everybody else: Image
Does anyone have any idea on how to make a free range roomba farm? :think:
Image The results of logic, of natural progression? Boring! An expected result? Dull! An obvious next step? Pfui! Where is the fun in that? A dream may soothe, but our nightmares make us run!
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#633
You know you're on the road to recovery when you can face the demons and those that you feel (rightly or wrongly) you let down.

While most regulars could sense something not quite the same, it is all about your real life support network and being able to ask for help.

I'm glad you got it Josh and that you're on the road again.

The game, any game, not just limit theory - will still be there for you. You might want to play a few sessions before delving in to any code work but that's just because those videos looked so damn good. In the meantime - stay healthy and wise, hug your family every day and punch your friends in the face (also a great stress reliever too).

Enjoy the weather and the meds, but of course not too much.
Life is about memories, the more the better.
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#636
Talvieno wrote:there's no need to complain after just eleven days.
So what about 29 days? Yeah, I know guys, everyone here is going to hate on me for calling a spade a spade. Because we all - and yes, I include myself - wish for Josh's well-being. But what everyone misses is that it's inappropriate to conflate two issues: that is, Josh's well-being and the well-being of our pledges. After all, this is not a Josh support group - much as some of us make it out to be.

This is a site dedicated to the followers of an idea, the idea being limit theory. And, this is a forum for the participants in a business venture to discuss their investment - of both time, and money - in the business venture and what is coming of it.

What is appropriate? To have respect for fellow human beings, surely. And a big part of respect is holding each other accountable for their portion of the agreement. In this case, the agreement is we pre-order a game in development, and in exchange, that game is produced over a certain timeframe, updates are provided as proof-of-progress, and the game is delivered.

At this point, every single backer has held up their end; we've all paid the money we promised, and Josh has not only not delivered, but has failed to update, failed to show progress, and failed to deliver on any of the time goals he's made.

I understand the objections which state that his history of updating and progressing lends him credibility, which should offset some of the troubles he's having now, and I agree. So I ask again: what is appropriate? To me, this is no longer a game in development. This is a game which has fallen off because the developer has entered a life crisis. My heart goes out to the guy - really, it does - but at the end of the day, he still has his end of the obligation to meet. I don't care how he does it, whether it means hiring others to take over his portion, selling the IP, or just grinning and bearing it, slogging through and getting it done. Ultimately, he needs to manage his time and deal with his issues, but it is not our job - not mine, and not yours - to see to it he takes care of himself appropriately. It is our job to provide our end of the agreement, and it is Josh's job to provide his.

Past successes and progress aside, Josh continues to make claims and fail to uphold them. "I will road to beta" was one claim. "I am back and working towards making progress on the game again now guys" was another claim. I'm paraphrasing, obviously. Point is, he keeps making empty statements. It's reasonable for confidence to be lost. And while I said before I'd give him another chance, he's not making good on it.

I don't really care if all of you shit on me for saying this, because I realize there's a lot of emotional people who can relate to his issues out here, but Josh - you need to work yourself out and get back to the job you promised to do. No more happy-sappy forum hugs for you, that's not helping anything. You've had months and months to work this out. Get back to the job we already paid you to do.

This isn't right, and it isn't responsible, and continuing to make empty promises will only carry you for so long among those who are committed to "believing in you" against all evidence suggesting that you are no longer a safe bet. My heart goes out to you for your problems, but your problems are not my problems. Resolve them, and do so in a timely fashion. You're long past the point where we can reasonably be expected to offer you any sort of consideration for personal issues.
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#638
I guess there is a question that needs to be answered. What is Josh required to do to fulfill his side of the Kickstarter?

Josh delivered daily updates on Limit Theory from December 23, 2012 up to January 9, 2015 when he decided to change to the weekly Road to Beta format which started on January 14 and ended on January 23, 2015. Throughout this time Josh also had provided monthly video updates. Then the stress over took Josh and halted the majority of development and communication from Josh until May 31, 2015 when Josh announced what had happened to him. It's now the beginning of August and people are asking for Josh to push out Limit Theory.

Plain and simple I believe that LT is still incomplete. If Josh is making as much progress as he did before his May 31st update, he still has a few months to go before LT has the base features promised in the Kickstarter. If development is occurring at a slower, healthier pace, then it's possible that development may be pushed out into early 2016.

What is required by the Kickstarter? What evidence of development are the backers obligated to receive? Keeping in mind that the backers may not see the release of Limit Theory until early 2016.
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#640
BFett wrote:I guess there is a question that needs to be answered. What is Josh required to do to fulfill his side of the Kickstarter? [...] What is required by the Kickstarter? What evidence of development are the backers obligated to receive? Keeping in mind that the backers may not see the release of Limit Theory until early 2016.
Here is an interesting note in the FAQ:
If a creator is absolutely unable to complete the project and fulfill rewards, they must make every reasonable effort to find another way of bringing the project to a satisfying conclusion for their backers. For more information, see Section 4 of our Terms of Use.
Secion 4, Terms of Use:
If a creator is unable to complete their project and fulfill rewards, they’ve failed to live up to the basic obligations of this agreement. To right this, they must make every reasonable effort to find another way of bringing the project to the best possible conclusion for backers. A creator in this position has only remedied the situation and met their obligations to backers if:

they post an update that explains what work has been done, how funds were used, and what prevents them from finishing the project as planned;
they work diligently and in good faith to bring the project to the best possible conclusion in a timeframe that’s communicated to backers;
they’re able to demonstrate that they’ve used funds appropriately and made every reasonable effort to complete the project as promised;
they’ve been honest, and have made no material misrepresentations in their communication to backers; and
they offer to return any remaining funds to backers who have not received their reward (in proportion to the amounts pledged), or else explain how those funds will be used to complete the project in some alternate form.

The creator is solely responsible for fulfilling the promises made in their project. If they’re unable to satisfy the terms of this agreement, they may be subject to legal action by backers.
This is an excerption that's releveant to the lack of updates:
they post an update that explains what work has been done, how funds were used, and what prevents them from finishing the project as planned;
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#641
I would reread that if I were you. :P
If a creator is unable to complete their project and fulfill rewards[...] A creator in this position has only remedied the situation and met their obligations to backers if:
they post an update that explains what work has been done, how funds were used, and what prevents them from finishing the project as planned;
He's only supposed to give an update if he decides he's not gonna be able to finish LT, and last thing we heard this was definitely not the case.
Warning: do not ask about physics unless you really want to know about physics.
The LT IRC / Alternate link || The REKT Wiki || PUDDING
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Re: The End of the Dark Days.

#643
To me, it all breaks down to choosing between proceeding "the official way" and trying to exercise my rights as investor, and understanding the human nature of such lone undertaking and its possible effect on Josh's psyche. So which one would I chose? Well, maybe the world isn't fair out there, but I want it to be. My choice is understanding and if Josh decides to abandon the project, his health issues outweighing finishing the game, I understand that.

Ultimately, the choice is yours - personally, I would like to treat Josh the way I wanted to be treated if I was in his shoes.
Cause in the end, we're all human beings and we need to treat each other as exactly that. "Business knows no mercy"? Then f**k business!

That said, what happens if LT is never released? I will be disappointed, a lot...
But would I say "Josh, you disappointed me!"? NO!

I'm proud of you, Josh!

Just remember, the only loser is the one who never even tried making his dreams come true.
If finishing LT proves to be too much for you to take on all alone, leave it. Knowledge you gained along the way will profit you for the rest of your life, should you chose to continue your developer career, and if my donation contributed to it - I'm all the more happy I was able to help.

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