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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#16
Very inspiring video, the first few seconds gave me a goose bumps, this redish system with dust is so cool looking.
I want to sum up few things that need to be fixed for it to be almost perfect (graphically), its not a criticism just a testers habit to look for such things :)

1. You forget to update front page of LT website. ;)
2. Asteroids popping from still attract a lot of attention.
3. Bigger planets and distances (double precision).
4. Maybe make warp gates to end quite far from planets, so you still have to use cruise mode to reach it?
5. Lenses, lighting and other things you know about.
6. Also, i see some rough edges on objects, is AA implemented?

So far this is the best space sim project, as E:D looks uncertain to me and SC will be to restricted in player actions .
I really regret that didn’t backed this months ago. :(

But still, you alone made much more than any other big company with their projects (IMO). Please continue to create our shared dream.
I̲̩̳̺̩̫n̵̻̘͚͖̗͎ͅ ͢J̜̬̗̦o̩̘̦̪͕͉ͅs͞h̞͘ ̯̹͈͙w̯̙̥e̱͉ ̬̙̘̭̯̦͕t̹͖͔̖͘r͚̠̰͍͚̹ụ̸̭͍͕̯̹̙s̩͓̼̲̲͉̹t̰.̴͈̖͙̜̲

We will never forget the "Heavenly hundred"
Failures lead to success.
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#17
Gazz wrote:Breaking News!
Telurian Rubble Kitten Has The Cutest Frown!

See our video reports on pages 2 and 3!

In Further News: Starship Captain Invents Asteroid Mining

When asked for his expert opinion, the royal astrologist commented: "Wait what? I think you have the wrong number."
Would you like to know more?
- The Snark Knight

"Look upward, and share the wonders I've seen."
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#18
Commander McLane wrote:I'm still watching the video, and am properly impressed. But I just had to pause it and get over here to post one very strange thing: at 09:09, the sun suddenly pops out of existence. That looks very odd. What was happening there?
Yep, I commented on this somewhere on youtube - there's a glitch with lens flare occlusion for flares that are offscreen. Will fix as soon as I figure out the cause!
mcsven wrote:Josh - looks great! As usual, I am intensely jealous of the skill and ambition demonstrated in the updates and dev logs. Keep it up, dude, you're an inspiration.

On the subject of the AI, I was wondering: do they reason on different time-scales? I was wondering if their previous choices (e.g. mining over piracy) will affect their future choices (i.e. they've developed some skill at mining that biases them towards it in the future)?

Have you fully landed on the AI personality attributes or can we have some fun throwing out suggestions?
Hmm not currently, but maybe I will implement some kind of "skill factor" at some point so that they will get better at what they do? Haven't thought much about that. And of course, you can always have fun throwing out suggestions!
domanite wrote:As I was watching the video, something was nagging me about that beautiful rich asteroid field, and I finally put my finger on it. None of the asteroids are rotating - they all keep the same orientation with respect to each other. Has it always been that way?

Also - great update - they never fail to inspire!
Rotating asteroids has been addressed several times, short answer is: not likely to happen :|
Shuul wrote:Very inspiring video, the first few seconds gave me a goose bumps, this redish system with dust is so cool looking.
I want to sum up few things that need to be fixed for it to be almost perfect (graphically), its not a criticism just a testers habit to look for such things :)

1. You forget to update front page of LT website. ;)
2. Asteroids popping from still attract a lot of attention.
3. Bigger planets and distances (double precision).
4. Maybe make warp gates to end quite far from planets, so you still have to use cruise mode to reach it?
5. Lenses, lighting and other things you know about.
6. Also, i see some rough edges on objects, is AA implemented?

So far this is the best space sim project, as E:D looks uncertain to me and SC will be to restricted in player actions .
I really regret that didn’t backed this months ago. :(

But still, you alone made much more than any other big company with their projects (IMO). Please continue to create our shared dream.
1. Always...at this point it's nothing short of a tradition :oops: :roll:
2. Looking into it
3. Yes, still need double precision
4. System layouts + warp lanes are both a sad joke at the moment :shock:
5. Yerp
6. Good eye, you're correct that AA was turned off in this video. It's implemented but I'm unhappy with how it dulls some of the sharp details that should remain sharp. I will be searching for a new solution.
“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.” ~ Henry Ford
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#19
Just_Ice_au wrote:
Gazz wrote:Breaking News!
Telurian Rubble Kitten Has The Cutest Frown!

See our video reports on pages 2 and 3!

In Further News: Starship Captain Invents Asteroid Mining

When asked for his expert opinion, the royal astrologist commented: "Wait what? I think you have the wrong number."
Would you like to know more?
Hell yes! A Starship Troopers reference! :D
JoshParnell wrote:Rotating asteroids has been addressed several times, short answer is: not likely to happen :|
Minor detail. In the end they're all going to be rubble to support my vast interstellar trading empire! Muahahahahaha... :twisted:
In Josh we trust.
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#20
Another great video... and I don't even like videos.

1. I'm also very interested in the NPC personality design.

2. As "excited" ;) as I am for the AI architecture reaching its necessary foundational state, in most of this video it was described in tactical terms -- individuals making local, immediate decisions. How will this architecture work at operational (fleet/sector) and strategic (faction/multi-sector) gameplay levels?

One interesting note: I've been a reader of Rock Paper Shotgun for several years now. They, and their commenters, can be pretty hard on games in development. Snarkiness is very common there.

Which I mention to highlight that the latest Limit Theory post on RPS is overwhelmingly positive, including in the comments, both about Limit Theory as revealed so far and Josh's work ethic, competence, and friendliness. I don't think I've ever seen any project or developer held in such high esteem.

Josh, this isn't to put pressure on you; you're obviously self-motivated. It's to let you know that the great job you've been doing so far is seen and appreciated. Keep up the great work, and let us know if there's anything we can do to help beyond moral support and Gazz's five-page concept outlines. :)
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#21
Easy to underestimate good AI as it isnt 'shiny' - but this does look really impressive in terms of potential and progress :)

Liked the lighting and graphical updating - kudos Josh, coming along nicely :)

Liked the headlights and shinies idea too :D

Keep going fella!! :monkey:
fraggdya's list of unreasonable demands!
1. I would like a tannoy in my ship that plays 'Ride of the Valkyries' on repeat.
2. A replica of the Icarus II ship
3. A shrubbery
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#23
Flatfingers wrote:One interesting note: I've been a reader of Rock Paper Shotgun for several years now. They, and their commenters, can be pretty hard on games in development. Snarkiness is very common there.

Which I mention to highlight that the latest Limit Theory post on RPS is overwhelmingly positive, including in the comments, both about Limit Theory as revealed so far and Josh's work ethic, competence, and friendliness. I don't think I've ever seen any project or developer held in such high esteem.

Josh, this isn't to put pressure on you; you're obviously self-motivated. It's to let you know that the great job you've been doing so far is seen and appreciated. Keep up the great work, and let us know if there's anything we can do to help beyond moral support and Gazz's five-page concept outlines. :)
Well expressed Flatfingers. :clap: I usually read the RPS posts but I hadn't seen this one. Josh knows he has a great community here and appreciates all that this community does for him. I suppose I will be in trouble for saying this but he gets massive support from both the EC and the General forums and is well aware of how fortunate he is to have such dedicated members. :D
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#24
fraggdya wrote:Liked the headlights and shinies idea too :D
Keep going fella!! :monkey:
Now this is a completely whacky idea but if you like playing with lights, put automatic search lights on your ship that slowly "seek" targeted vessels.
WW2 style.

If one locks onto a target, that gives every allied ship an aiming bonus - a reduction on the "scatter" of every individual bullet.
There is no "I" in Tea. That would be gross.
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#26
That's quite a bunch on the graphical features.

And you implemented some kind of logic programming language for AI, too...? Neat!

Do you imagine it will be able to do some thing really difficult? Like, say, finding a (near-)optimal course of action when you tell it to get about 40% of its income from trading while it is also 60% mining? Or make a decision whether to fend off an attack or run when it's just about done with mining? (I understand this could get ridiculously computationally complex, but if you trigger the computations only at the right moments, then perhaps...?)
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#27
As a prelude to my (short) list of gripes, I will emphasize that planets are not among of them. In fact, I find them rather satisfyingly vast already. But Josh has promised to finish the double precision upgrade, and I trust that he will, and I trust that I'll be blown away. As per usual with most every LT graphics forward leap (think textures, lighting, water & planetscape, dust).

Now, to unburden the minor & petty gripes. First, couldn't hear the music very well. This has been a problem for me for several updates now. In the beginning (and I'm thinking particularly of #2) Josh did much better with this, and I miss being able to hear the beautiful LT soundscape just as well and as a compliment to his soothing DJ voice. Next, a complaint about nebulae: this was zomgfalloutamychairTHATSOSHINY! ..and what we've been seeing since in updates since have been very blah by comparison. I understand that they do have to be toned down for gameplay purposes, but can we expect them to get more crisp & exciting as we come up on release? Umm.. oh, and that station was horrible. I mean, it was essentially the same as the last but somehow managed to look worse. And the little debris that flies by to give a sense of speed? Is it just me or could it stand being more subtle?

But enough of that! Dynamic lighting!! :shock: WOOO!! And awesome dust! And remarkably effective even in WIP-state lens flares! And cruise mode colour change, according to that recent forum suggestion. Looking forward to the intuitive windowed UI unveiling..

On my wishlist for next update: alot more asteroid peppering and an asteroid landing or two. Also, a reenactment of the trench run & missile barrage of yore, with shields back up & running, using something like #6s battleship, now with running lights and mebbe (ok, now this extravagantly wishful) spiced up explosions, set on the threshold of a dust cloud. All this somehow cleverly bundled in with all the AI magics that will shortly unfold. Too much? Hey, I figure where LT development expectations are concerned, go Big or go home.
"omg such tech many efficiency WOW" ~ Josh Parnell
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#28
Awesome update as usual :)

Asteroid 'pop' has been mentioned already, so now we have those dust clouds that work to hide that in the instances they occupy the same zone as the asteroids, what about the asteroids in clear space?

In the Elite series of games, and in particular FFE (or the modern FFED3D version) the representation of planets and suns at distance uses a different graphic until the 3D object 'pops' into view and takes over. That game uses simple static bitmaps to represent the 3D object at the further distances before the 3D model is rendered. Now there are lots more objects in an asteroid field, but maybe some kind of smoke+mirrors system like that could work to avoid the 'popping' the asteroids currently do in clear space?

Or could all asteroid fields have some element of dust cloud at distance to cover over the popping perhaps?

The AI thing sounds really interesting and i look forward to seeing how it all plays out as you add the layers of details for that system to play around with, you might end up making a self aware program, so be careful (maybe have a rule set to avoid Skynet, just in case)!!
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#29
Game looks awesome, but two things bugged me in the video, they're small things I think, but first would be that the animation for the lasers or beams from your weapons starts behind the turrets. What I mean is when you're shooting, the tail of the beam/laser appears before the front of the turret, and even behind your spaceship. Would there be a way to make them not appear until they have left the turrets by a bit, I don't know, either way, just seems like they aren't positioned in the right place, so on smaller ships, they may just appear to be cutting through the ship, or appearing from the back. In the video an example is at around 6 minutes when he is firing, not directly ahead, but on an angle to the side of the ship. The tail of the shots appears behind the turret, and behind the ship.

Second thing is the highway gates at 12 minutes in. You see an NPC jump through them, but I don't think they are necessary, as it's only 2 gates long from the space station to the planet. Seems unnecessary. I feel like it would take the same amount of time to travel to the front of the first gate and shoot to the second one, as it would to just fly to the second one in cruise mode. Maybe make it so that there is a distance cut off between things, so if a station is really close to a planet, there isn't the highway connecting them, as it doesn't seem needed?

Just my ten cents =)
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Re: Development Update #9: September 2013

#30
Ateerix wrote:Second thing is the highway gates at 12 minutes in. You see an NPC jump through them, but I don't think they are necessary, as it's only 2 gates long from the space station to the planet.
Don't worry. Essentially the system Josh is flying through is just a mock-up. The points of interest (like planets and stations) will be much farther apart in the final game. They're just artificially cramped together for the videos, so that flying from one point to another doesn't take up too much video time. ;)

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