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Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:30 pm
    • #376 by Silverware
    BFett wrote:The creator exists outstde the dimension of time, he was not created.
    If god can, why can't others?

    God can create, but so can man, he created us in his own image after all. Not as a pale reflection, but as fully fledged individuals.
    We have created, and destroyed, particles and objects.
    We have modified life directly, and created synthetic DNA (although based on an existing cell) and inserted it into a cell scraped empty of DNA and had it replicate.

    If it can be done by anything, it can be done by everything.
    °˖✧◝(ಠ‸ಠ)◜✧˖°
    WebGL Spaceships and Trails
    <Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
    console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:33 pm
    • #377 by Poet1960
    Silverware wrote:
    Poet1960 wrote:Why? Did the matrix just glitch?
    You are working with self-replicating robots, obviously they can evolve a form of intelligence once enough of them are networked. And once intelligent, they can conceive of and produce a device to manipulate time, and therefore can ensure it's own existence by closing the loop.

    Well, until the creator of those robots gets tired of their shenanigans, and decides to pull the plug.
    Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
    Post

    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:36 pm
    • #378 by Silverware
    Poet1960 wrote:
    Silverware wrote:
    Poet1960 wrote:Why? Did the matrix just glitch?
    You are working with self-replicating robots, obviously they can evolve a form of intelligence once enough of them are networked. And once intelligent, they can conceive of and produce a device to manipulate time, and therefore can ensure it's own existence by closing the loop.

    Well, until the creator of those robots gets tired of their shenanigans, and decides to pull the plug.
    When dealing with a closed loop like this, one doesn't just pull the plug.
    Fucking with a stable temporal loop can lead to unexpected consequences.
    °˖✧◝(ಠ‸ಠ)◜✧˖°
    WebGL Spaceships and Trails
    <Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
    console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
    Post

    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:41 pm
    • #380 by BFett
    We are not gods. We can't make a real universe like the one we live in. Even if we could, it would take effort and would not be some random event you believe it to be.

    We are not all powerful, or all knowing. If the uniserse were a cherry pie, then there would have to be a creator regardless of what those living in the cherry pie thought.
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    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:50 pm
    • #381 by Silverware
    Poet1960 wrote:
    Silverware wrote:
    When dealing with a closed loop like this, one doesn't just pull the plug.
    frakking with a stable temporal loop can lead to unexpected consequences.

    Oh dear. I better tell H.G. Wells to be careful then. :mrgreen:
    Wells knows better, which is why he writes stories about it, and doesn't actually screw around with temporal loops. :thumbup:
    Screwing with time is not smart, unless you know EXACTLY what you are doing, and even then, don't do it. It's safer not to.


    BFett wrote:We are not gods. We can't make a real universe like the one we live in. Even if we could, it would take effort and would not be some random event you believe it to be.

    We are not all powerful, or all knowing. If the uniserse were a cherry pie, then there would have to be a creator regardless of what those lining in the cherry pie thought.
    What evidence do you have of that? There is nothing withing science that prohibits the creation of a universe within a universe, and plenty that suggests it is entirely possible.
    And yes, it would take effort. But I don't believe it is random, you would know this if you took a moment to read any of the times I have explained my own views of what started this universe.

    Humans don't have to be all powerful or all knowing. Our machines can be as powerful as we need, and we can not only learn, but also store whatever we need to know.
    Beyond a book written by man 1400 hundred years ago, and another written a thousand or so years before that, there is no evidence that the creator of the universe is actually All Knowing or All Powerful.
    Especially as he would have to have been a prick if he knew that mankind would spawn and do nasty shit to each other, being All Knowing kinda includes knowing what will happen from your actions, and all other actions, it's part of the definition.


    But anyway, onto my own beliefs.

    I believe that the universe is a closed loop, that mankind (or another race inside the universe, just hoping it's us) eventually either create a computer powerful enough to simulate the universe, or actually create a bubble universe.
    This universe in either case is created with the same properties as this universe so that we can use it to predict events that happened at the beginning of the universe.
    And with all the same properties, and deterministic rules, that universe is our own.
    In my view, we are the creators, we are the being that created the universe with the express goal of creating an identical universe.
    °˖✧◝(ಠ‸ಠ)◜✧˖°
    WebGL Spaceships and Trails
    <Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
    console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
    Post

    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:50 pm
    • #382 by Dinosawer
    Poet1960 wrote: Aren't you assuming that He was created?
    I'm not, cause I don't think he exists. I'm merely applying your logic that anything apparently had to be created (including all life, the universe and matter itself) to the logical extension.
    Poet1960 wrote: God is outside of time, He created it. [...] He didn't come into existence at all. He always was.
    What does 'always' mean if there is no time? That's like trying to define the volume of a square...
    Poet1960 wrote: Why is that so difficult for you to believe?
    Because I cannot rhyme the world we live in with there being an omnipotent and infinitely good god being in charge.
    Like, if god created everything and nothing evolves, why did he create diseases? If design is intelligent, why do we have an intestine that serves literally no purpose but has a good chance of killing us when it gets infected? Why do our food and air tubes come out in the same hole? Why do some people's own bodes attack themselves lethally when exposed to certain everyday substances?
    etc etc
    Poet1960 wrote: It's astounding how you think anyone that believes in a creator god is somehow delusional, yet completely accept any other theory, no matter how much mental contortion it requires to believe, as long as it doesn't include a god.
    WE came into existence through His agency. Not the other way around.
    Well yes, if those people then believe things that are in direct contradiction to observable reality... and seem to choose arbitrary which parts of the book™ they take literally and which they don't.
    I don't accept any other theory. Only the ones that are falsifiable, and tested. Goddidit isn't falsifiable, and is therefore of as much scientific value as saying The Flying Spaghetti Monster created us all.
    (His Noodly Appendages touch us all)
    Warning: do not ask about physics unless you really want to know about physics.
    The LT IRC / Alternate link || The REKT Wiki || PUDDING
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    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:52 pm
    • #383 by Poet1960
    BFett wrote:We are not gods. We can't make a real universe like the one we live in. Even if we could, it would take effort and would not be some random event you believe it to be.

    We are not all powerful, or all knowing. If the uniserse were a cherry pie, then there would have to be a creator regardless of what those living in the cherry pie thought.

    Well, not exactly true.

    Psa 82:4  Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked. 
    Psa 82:5  They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course. 
    Psa 82:6  I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. 
    Psa 82:7  But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes. 
    Psa 82:8  Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations. 

    Joh 10:33  The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God. 
    Joh 10:34  Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? 
    Joh 10:35  If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken; 
    Joh 10:36  Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God? 
    Joh 10:37  If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. 
    Joh 10:38  But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him. 

    We are not THE God, but we ARE made in His image. Baby gods so to speak. We have god qualities, but we also have sinful qualities. We are capable of great things, and we are capable of terrible things. The knowledge of good and evil remember? We have both.

    So yes, we are gods in a sense, but we are not the God who created the heavens and the earth, but we are His sons and daughters, even if we ourselves reject Him.

    The power to say no, is also the power to say yes. Those who have kids will understand this. Once your children have grown, they are able to say no to you as disappointing as that may be to you. But how much better is it, when they say yes?
    Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
    Post

    Re: The Religion Thread

  • Wed Dec 21, 2016 2:58 pm
    • #389 by Silverware
    Dinosawer wrote:Not null, null is defined.

    Code: Select all

    NameError: name 'z' is not defined
    In Javascript you would find this to not be true. :V

    Code: Select all

    5 * 5 * null; // 0
    Additionally

    Code: Select all

    null !== 0; // true
    °˖✧◝(ಠ‸ಠ)◜✧˖°
    WebGL Spaceships and Trails
    <Cuisinart8> apparently without the demon driving him around Silver has the intelligence of a botched lobotomy patient ~ Mar 04 2020
    console.log(`What's all ${this} ${Date.now()}`);
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