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Re: Rocket Lunches

#271
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:04 am
"dont ever try to do rocketry better than the russians did since the 60s! its compltely pointless! there can be no improvements!"
Warm seawater is very corrosive - and it's a scientific fact that doesn't depend on your worldview :-)

That's why Boeing's Starliner spaceship potentially has it easier in the terms of re-usability - because it's designed to soft-land on land, and not splash down. SpaceX, as usual, does it a little bit differently, although it's not entirely their fault - NASA just didn't feel comfortable with fully powered landing. Why did they decide to go all the way back and splash down is beyond me; probably, being short on cash and tech, and not feeling they'd convince NASA that they can do a rocket-assisted landing on land anyway.

Russians actually did land some spacecraft on water - the BOR series of reuseable test vehicles, in the Indian ocean, back in the 70s (and I don't know the reason for that, must check and ask people in the know), but the actual vehicle (that later became the Buran) was of course designed to land on a runway.
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Survivor of the Josh Parnell Blackout of 2015.
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#272
outlander wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:27 am
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:04 am
"dont ever try to do rocketry better than the russians did since the 60s! its compltely pointless! there can be no improvements!"
Warm seawater is very corrosive - and it's a scientific fact that doesn't depend on your worldview :-)
because there could never be a material that is impervious to seawater?
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#273
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 11:57 am
because there could never be a material that is impervious to seawater?
It's mostly seals, electronics, sensors, some Al and Al-Mg parts. Some composites don't like water as well, and do unpredictable things. I'd say it's easier to land on land than bother with water-proofing (which is weight, complexity, and more seals :V). Why solve the problem when you can work around it?
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Survivor of the Josh Parnell Blackout of 2015.
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#275
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:40 pm
because the extra stuff and control for soft landing may is more effort than solving the (mostly materials science) problems with water landing. a salt proof seal is also less moving parts than a fine-tuned softland rocket control system :V
/me is not talking about the outside.

You open the hatch, the fine water mist enters the capsule, and starts condensing in all the places :ghost: Why even bother? SpaceX wanted a proper soft landing on the solid ground anyway.
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Survivor of the Josh Parnell Blackout of 2015.
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#278
outlander wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:14 pm
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:07 pm
and i wasnt talking about capsules, though :D i was talking about first and second stage ish stuff :D
Ah, OK. In my opinion, the additional engineering challenge of water-proofing is not worth it economically.
well, it maybe isnt. but its not a completely clear-cut thing as soft landing isnt a trivial endeavour either.
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#279
Cornflakes_91 wrote:
Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:17 pm
well, it maybe isnt. but its not a completely clear-cut thing as soft landing isnt a trivial endeavour either.
Nothing about space is clear-cut. But soft-landing on the ground, right at the site where post-landing assessment and maintenance would be performed, seems like an optimal solution - one that reduces time and transportation costs. Water landings have a whole host of stupid problems associated with recovery, transportation, and refurbishment of the flown vehicle / stage. It's not enough to just blow some nitrogen through the engine and call it a day - even in the water-proof design all the components would have to be expected and verified as undamaged just in case (NASA would demand that for sure).

I'd say, there's a strong case to go for soft-landing on land for reusable vehicles.
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Survivor of the Josh Parnell Blackout of 2015.
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Re: Rocket Lunches

#282
<nods> Maiden flights can be tricky!

I can't help but wonder what a future alien, visiting the Solar System long after all trace of mankind has disappeared, would make of a cherry-red Tesla Roadster driven by a spacesuited dummy floating somewhere between Earth and Mars.
We pray for one last landing
On the globe that gave us birth
Let us rest our eyes on the fleecy skies
And the cool, green hills of Earth

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